Abandon Tree Straps?

**nothermark** · 10-12-2011, 18:39

Originally Posted by cevans

I have seen trees with 1 inch cable wrapped around them and they grow over it, I have seen lots of trees with barbed wire in them and fencing and they grow threw it, nails, spikes, you name it, lots of saw mills saw thru steel and ruin lots of blades,,Trees are pretty resilient. I think for the most however, to appease all the enviromentals, the national parks people, the state parks people, and to promote hammock hanging as a safe and enviromental friendly way of backpacking and to take away any doubt whatso ever,,,we are better off to use a tree strap. Its a small weight penality that we should have to pay to promote our sport of hanging. Just my 2 cents.

None of the above are the problem. As you say, trees can grow around things. The reason for using straps is to reduce the point load on the tree's inner cambium layer. That is the layer that transports sap up and down the tree trunk. If that is sufficiently damaged the tree dies. The thinner the line around the tree the higher the load per unit area and the more likely the inner layer will be crushed. Using flat webbing increases the area for a given weight so decreases the internal pressure load per unit area.
If you need a visual aid think of a wire frame cheese cutter. The wire goes through the cheese relatively easily because the force per unit area is high on the thin wire for a mild pull on the handle. Try holding the wire and pulling the handle through the cheese. Start gently, the fingers you save may be your own. ;-)

**Gra_factor** · 10-12-2011, 21:48

Originally Posted by cevans

I have seen trees with 1 inch cable wrapped around them and they grow over it, I have seen lots of trees with barbed wire in them and fencing and they grow threw it, nails, spikes, you name it, lots of saw mills saw thru steel and ruin lots of blades,,Trees are pretty resilient. I think for the most however, to appease all the enviromentals, the national parks people, the state parks people, and to promote hammock hanging as a safe and enviromental friendly way of backpacking and to take away any doubt whatso ever,,,we are better off to use a tree strap. Its a small weight penality that we should have to pay to promote our sport of hanging. Just my 2 cents.

I'm no arborist, but I would bet that tying up and removing different cords at different times by different people on the same tree trunk would be qualitatively different than wrapping a cable around a tree trunk and leaving it there for years. That assumes of course that the tree in question was being used regularly for hammock camping, which I would imagine some are.

In Australia the early settlers used to "ring bark" trees as an low labor way to kill them, to clear the land for agriculture. They would cut into the tree all the way around and strip off a thin layer of bark and that was all that was needed to kill the tree. That's because the actual living part of the tree is on the outside under the bark, the rest is like a skeleton.

Now obviously tying an amsteel cord around the tree is not the same as cutting off the bark, but it must move a little in that direction.

**Roadtorque** · 10-12-2011, 18:01

I dont think my tree straps weigh enough to bother leaving them at home...just in case it helps the tree

**slowhike** · 10-12-2011, 18:07

Trees can often times take a lot of abuse.

But damage opens the door for problems the tree might not survive. That's why land managers are so protective of trees.
We won't win friends in the public forest by damaging the trees we hang from.

**Jsaults** · 10-12-2011, 18:15

The weight of goodwill is about two ounces (my estimate of the weight of two tree straps).

"See here Mr/Ms Ranger? I am a responsible camper. I go overboard to protect the bark of the trees."

I love Tinny's vids. but I think he is out in left field on this one.

Jim

**mugs** · 10-15-2011, 00:17

Originally Posted by Jsaults

The weight of goodwill is about two ounces (my estimate of the weight of two tree straps).

"See here Mr/Ms Ranger? I am a responsible camper. I go overboard to protect the bark of the trees."

I love Tinny's vids. but I think he is out in left field on this one.

Jim

Tiny tends to talk out of his "yoo hoo" a lot. Great stove maker yes. Opinionated, out spoken, and looking to argue about something is usually the case I have found with is videos...Sort of a know it all, when he may not know much at all....Just my two cents.

Nothing against Tiny..just my impression of him.

**Dos** · 10-15-2011, 01:30

I am new here.

Have watched over 5 hours of Shug videos.
2 hours of Tinny videos.

Seems this is a Tinny lynching.

But....
He started it. (e.g lemmings remark and, ad infinitum, posting on You Tube to whomever may wander....uh..think internets here in general. anyone can post)

Tinny obviously feels slighted.
tinny struck out.
Hammock forum struck out.

Do you all srsly hike together? (think Darwin here).

Plz try to think bigger picture here.

Although, I agree, his stoves are the bomb.
Tinny, and the rest of the forum: place nice and get along.

Tinny...be nice until you have a handle on current flair in stock
and how it performs
(and with scientific back up)

Everyone else: go build something DIY.

...or camp.

oh
ps

I built my own house in WA State in Old Growth section of the Deschutes River.
Have seen PLENTY of things done to trees older than I am on my property.

if it makes rangers feel better, then do the strap.( and you know how long it takes to educate people
about common things like women's rights, black voters rights, etc)
Why waste a perfectly good whoopie sling ?

**Dutch** · 10-12-2011, 18:15

I think we have the burden of making sure the tree is not damaged. Hammocks are very good at LNT but one concern. I believe the concern is valid but even if it isn't we have to give others the utmost confidence that we are not worse for the environment in any way because there are those that will use the idea that we are harmfup to the trees to validate not allowing hammocks in parks.
I hung without a strap and it damaged teh bark. I now use strap every time.

Tinny sure does make great stoves.

**hangNyak** · 10-12-2011, 18:28

Originally Posted by Dutch

Tinny sure does make great stoves.

Nice!

**pb&j** · 10-12-2011, 20:54

Y'all said it all. Probably not every tree would be hurt, but until someone does a bunch of studies over a long period of time with all different kinds of trees, tree diameters, and in areas of varying hang traffic and then makes us a fancy spreadsheet, how do we make the call in the meantime?

As Ramblinrev said, damage does not have to be direct, and the results of damage may not have a visible effect until well after the hanger is gone from the site.

Guessing whether you are causing damage is not good enough--considering permission to hang in many or most of the places all of us hang is at stake.

Like the old saying goes--an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.