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  1. #1
    Senior Member
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    Question UL UQ DIY Idea - Air Insulated

    I am thinking of this idea, and would love to
    bounce this off your brilliant minds here at HF.

    Many of us know that AIR is one of the best insulators.

    My question is this......
    Can we put this to use for an underquilt?

    My idea stems from this. I remember being fascinated when
    researching about a very cheap and very lightweight pad that
    can be made using balloons. You must buy the heavy duty
    balloons, and you blow them up and insert them into a pad that
    has sleeves sewn into it. This means that the pad is nothing
    more than fabric when the balloons are removed, so it rolls into
    almost nothing. Plus, you can purchase the balloons cheap.

    Can this idea be used to create a baffled underquilt?
    I imagine that it would need a weathershield on the outside,
    but would the balloons add much warmth? What if there is IX
    between the balloons and weathershield?

    Of course some opposing views to this will be the difficulty in
    blowing up the balloons each time that you hang again. I have
    thought about this, but I would have fun with it. I do not know
    how long it would take for this to get old. Also, if you only use
    a balloon once, this would create trash, and it would continue to
    cost a few cents for every balloon that you destroy. I would think
    that you could tie the balloon with a slip-knot so that it could be
    removed and reused the next night.

    One of the benefits of using balloons like this, is that you can easily
    adjust your pad to your comfort, and determine how soft it is
    depending on how your back feels, or the way that you want to lay.


    Again, I have absolutely NO clue if this will work.... I just want to
    bounce this idea off of you all, before I invest any time or money
    into this experiment.

  2. #2
    Senior Member MDSH's Avatar
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    Air can and does transfer heat by convection so that is why voids are filled with insulating materials like fiberglass, down, et al.

    The best air mattresses now have down inside them.

    .
    Mike

    Learn to survive and thrive in any situation, for you never know what might happen. Love family and friends passionately. Suffer no fool. Know your purpose in life and follow it with all your heart.

  3. #3
    Senior Member
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    Moving air sucks heat away.
    I have always had the impression that
    if the air didn't move it woukdnt wick heat.

  4. #4
    Senior Member SteelToe's Avatar
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    If the air chambers are small (like in foam) the air cannot move enough to convect and move heat to the outside. If large, you will get slow and steady "whirlpools" of gas rising and falling inside the chambers, effectively surrounding you with slightly cooler air and increasing heat transmission. You also get a small amount of heat radiation shooting (relatively) far away from yourself to heat the outside wall of the baffle. That's why quilt gaps are bad; you have to heat yourself, as well as the volume of air surrounding yourself. Large chambers make that volume larger.

    TCB
    www.hammockforums.net --I get it!

  5. #5
    Senior Member Mountnman's Avatar
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    I am interested in seeing how it works if you try it. I think I would rather use a sleeping pad in the hammock that is insulated. And I could not imagine after a long day on the trail sitting there blowing up a bunch of balloons. I usually eat and hit the hammock
    "I love not man the less, but Nature more."
    Byron

  6. #6
    Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trambo.aka.sail1987 View Post
    I am thinking of this idea, and would love to
    bounce this off your brilliant minds here at HF.

    Many of us know that AIR is one of the best insulators.

    My question is this......
    Can we put this to use for an underquilt?

    My idea stems from this. I remember being fascinated when
    researching about a very cheap and very lightweight pad that
    can be made using balloons. You must buy the heavy duty
    balloons, and you blow them up and insert them into a pad that
    has sleeves sewn into it. This means that the pad is nothing
    more than fabric when the balloons are removed, so it rolls into
    almost nothing. Plus, you can purchase the balloons cheap.

    Can this idea be used to create a baffled underquilt?
    I imagine that it would need a weathershield on the outside,
    but would the balloons add much warmth? What if there is IX
    between the balloons and weathershield?

    Of course some opposing views to this will be the difficulty in
    blowing up the balloons each time that you hang again. I have
    thought about this, but I would have fun with it. I do not know
    how long it would take for this to get old. Also, if you only use
    a balloon once, this would create trash, and it would continue to
    cost a few cents for every balloon that you destroy. I would think
    that you could tie the balloon with a slip-knot so that it could be
    removed and reused the next night.

    One of the benefits of using balloons like this, is that you can easily
    adjust your pad to your comfort, and determine how soft it is
    depending on how your back feels, or the way that you want to lay.


    Again, I have absolutely NO clue if this will work.... I just want to
    bounce this idea off of you all, before I invest any time or money
    into this experiment.
    I actually tried playing with something like this a couple of years ago - I found a source of the balloon type thingies that are used for noise making at sporting events. They blow up with a straw insertion and I figured they could be deflated the same way. Wouldn't work!!...

    AND then I slept on an inflated air mattress without the benefit of a quilt underneath me - talk about CBS...

    Air doesn't warm up with body heat unless it's in very small chambers, like in foam or between strands of fibre in materials like Climashield.

    With all the talent around here, if we could stay warm with air, trust me, these guys would have perfected it by now...

  7. #7
    Member revdarryl's Avatar
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    Good effort !

  8. #8
    Senior Member
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    Answered my question lol.
    Thanks

  9. #9
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trambo.aka.sail1987 View Post
    Moving air sucks heat away.
    I have always had the impression that
    if the air didn't move it woukdnt wick heat.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trambo.aka.sail1987 View Post
    Answered my question lol.
    Thanks
    That's how we figure out new things, just keep brain storming and who knows what you or someone else will come up with!

    You are correct about "if the air didn't move it wouldn't wick heat", so you were on the right track there. That is the so called "dead air". Lot's of "dead air" trapped inside of various insulations like down or Climashield or closed cell foam etc. It can't move much so it can't take your body's warmth and transport it to the cold outside shell where it is transferred/exchanged. But inside an air mattress, the air is free to move every time you move at all, traveling freely from warm side to cold side. Or so I've been told, I've never been inside the air mattress to measure this! But I have heard many testify about how cold an uninsulated air mattress is.

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