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  1. #1
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Noobies, are you still cold? If so, here is a likely cure: The Shug Endorsed and tested Pod

    This is a method of using plain old down or synthetic insulation to virtually guarantee warmth in a gathered end hammock. It is the Pod approach, as used in the now defunct, but IMHO wonderful, Speer Pea Pod and Polar Pod. But, since no one will manufacture those anymore, perhaps as there is no demand, this thread is about a simple DIY way of accomplishing the same thing. I.E. converting the sleeping bag you probably already own into a pod.

    I was recently going over some of Shug's OLD threads. And I got a big kick when watching one to realize/remember that Shug had given me my only 5 seconds of fame ever! As I was watching this 10 year old video of Shug being toasty warm at minus 16F after lowering the total insulation from what he had used in earlier experiments, I suddenly was reminded at 10:40 into the video that he had given Fourdog, McEntyre and me a shout out for being the advocates of the Pea Pod that led him down this path. "Fourdog is the proponent of the Pea Pod, BillyBob is the potentate of the Pea Pod, and McEntyre is the bearded man of the Pea Pod". Well, let me say 10 years later: you are welcome, Shug, and thanks for the shout out! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_R5yH0rNMw

    So, what is it that Shug has been known to do, which seems to guarantee his warmth at minus 16F and in another video even at minus 40F? Well, he does not use an augmented 20F Speer Pea Pod like I used to do, but he rigged up the equivalent using what he already had on hand. Which is to say: a lightly modded(with a bit of shock cord added to the ends of it) 20F rated sleeping bag wrapped around his hammock. This forms the base "Pod". It is this bag which does what pods do better than most other hammock systems: provides a draft free approach, just as draft free as being in a zipped up mummy bag on the ground. But with the comfort of a hammock with TQ/UQ combo. But it is as though you had the UQ/TQ combo but did not have to worry about drafts that might sneak in when you roll around in your sleep, or about drafts sneaking in the foot end of an imperfectly adjusted UQ, or an adjustment that seems to change whenever you change positions.

    One probable negative to this approach is that - especially with wider/deeper hammocks - the sides of the hammock can lift the top side insulation up off of my torso, leaving a potentially cold gap, as well as leading to warm air escaping from whatever sized face vent I might be using. But, this was not much of a problem with my narrow Claytor No Net hammock, and I would often fill any gaps by layering puffy clothing on top of me rather than wearing them in the normal fashion. Or better yet, add a 20 to 50F quilt to fill that gap. Now, the top(and/or bottom) insulation is 4 to 5" thick, rather than 2.5", and good to below zero. The TQ filling the gap is additive to the loft of the pod(i.e. the bag) And still draft free.

    But I think another advantage as far as back warmth goes was support on the top side along the full length, once it is Velcroed or zipped closed. It is not just supported by the suspension added to the ends, if any, but by the sides of the hammock on both sides. This provides great support for the pod's bottom insulation AND any insulation that is placed between your back and the pod. You have heard of UQ clips? Used to attach your quilt to the hammock or it's RL in a place or 2? This is like quilt clips running continuously for the full length of the hammock.

    So, Shug's approach: At minus 16F, a partial length 30 to 40 degree (Frankenquilt) UQ suspended in the normal way under the hammock. A "summer" TQ (30F rated? 40F?) inside the hammock to be placed over your top side. Or, at minus 40F, replace those with equivalent zero rated TQ and partial length UQ. Now, add a 20F WM sleeping bag wrapped around ALL of that and zipped up. Bingo, a pod very warm and draft free to way below zero in both cases.

    For milder temps, say 10 or 20F, use a lighter sleeping bag for the pod, say a 40F or 50F. And or use lighter UQs(full length or partial) and TQs. Warmer still? Leave the UQs and TQs at the house. Just add puffy clothing if any thing is needed. Or, a pad can be added under the hammock, inside the pod. I have used all of these techniques over the years. For example, in one of my 1st tests of my 20F Speer Pea Pod, at +10F, I added a 2-3 oz space blanket between hammock and pod, and a 40-50F synthetic liner bag inside the pod. Nice and warm all night.

    So, are you not warm enough with your 20F quilts at 30 or 40F? And considering buying warmer quilts or some other quilt rating in order to stack over or under your current quilts? Well, that is one approach that will work. But another is: do you already have a sleeping bag? Even a very light, maybe a 40F or 50F one? Especially a wider, longer bag? if you have a ridge line, can you disconnect it at least long enough to wrap a bag around the hammock? If so, it might make for a worthwhile experiment. It might even work as well as or better than buying new quilts and/or stacking them. If you have time and materials on hand to do this, prepare to be warm and draft free!

  2. #2
    New Member Pippi's Avatar
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    I might actually try something like this next week. We're getting a bit colder here, but my winter setup has not come in the mail yet. This should get me by for the next month till it gets here. Thanks!
    Hiking my own hike and hanging my own hang. This is where my happy is!
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  3. #3
    all secure in sector 7 Shug's Avatar
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    I did not invent the concept but just used what I had on hand. And yes....I was warm in -40ºF.
    Shug

    Whooooo Buddy)))) All Secure in Sector Seven

  4. #4
    Senior Member OneClick's Avatar
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    One suggestion to skip: "sleeping over a dying fire".

  5. #5
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pippi View Post
    I might actually try something like this next week. We're getting a bit colder here, but my winter setup has not come in the mail yet. This should get me by for the next month till it gets here. Thanks!
    You are welcome! And you are in the exact group(but 1 of maybe 2 or 3 groups) who this is intended for! While waiting for a means of staying warm to arrive, or to be able to afford it in the first place, why not play with this concept? It will take a little experimentation, and tighter, shorter bags won't work as well bigger, and wider/deeper hammocks won't work as well. Then again, it might just work perfectly, or enough to get you by. So, seems worth experimenting with to me. Just remember you might want to try layering any puffy clothing over you to fill any gaps from the top bag layer being lifted by the hammock edges, which is a common problem(less so with narrow hammocks like Claytor or Switchback). One trick that worked great for me on a trip to the high WY mountains in early Sept, with lows in the 20s: I put my UL syn puffy jacket(about 12 oz) and my down vest on backwards. IOW, with the normal back of the unzipped jackets/vest towards my front, arms in the sleeves. This provided enough loft to fill any gap and seal around the face vent area to prevent escape of warm air. Good luck, hope it works for you, and hope your bag is big enough to not interfere with diagonal lay. And if you later find yourself in temps too cold for your new quilts, you can always wrap that bag around them for a huge boost.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shug View Post
    I did not invent the concept but just used what I had on hand. And yes....I was warm in -40ºF.
    Shug

    Well, I didn't invent it either, I just got it from Ed Speer. Who I'm sure did not invent it either, and in fact said he got the idea for his Pea Pod from a friend who, on a trip where both were cold, got the idea to wrap his bag around his hammock and solved his problem. BTW, I want to thank you for that title you bestowed on me all those years ago, "The Potentate of Pea Pods". That was at the same time a badge of honor(considering who it was coming from) and funny as heck. Which(being funny) is natural when also considering who it was coming from! I will always carry that title with pride!

    I really thought when you did your proof of concept experiments with pods, and they were so dang successful, that the world would turn to pods. Either making their own like you or buying a Speer Pea Pod rather than 2 full length quilts. But, few if any were ever interested, and now you can't buy one anymore. But, we can make our own as you did. I don't think I would like the bag conversion as much as I liked the Speer Pea Pod. Mostly because the Speer was long enough to cover- or almost cover- the hammock from end knot to end knot. (obviously less so with longer hammocks unless using a Polar Pod). Cinching down to a tiny almost zero opening over the suspension or last few inches of the hammock. It was 6 ft wide(much less wide on the ends) by 9 ft long. Remarkably, mine(900 FP) only weighed a bit over 40 oz, and TTTG/Switchback models some how weighed even less.

    I mainly am into Superior Gear Insulated hammocks now, but I still doubt it will ever beat that old Speer for over all function. My hope is that it will about match it, if I'm lucky. So far I love it.

    Quote Originally Posted by OneClick View Post
    One suggestion to skip: "sleeping over a dying fire".
    I think I will skip that one, now that you mention it!

  6. #6
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Now that the cold weather in approaching, this would be a good time for anyone who has not been quite warm enough with their quilts, especially if considering buying warmer quilts or just additional for stacking, to consider putting their old sleeping bag to use while experimenting with this method. Especially if they have those bigger bags with full length zippers. (Though I noticed Shug's bag did not have a full length zipper, and he still made it work)

  7. #7
    all secure in sector 7 Shug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    Now that the cold weather in approaching, this would be a good time for anyone who has not been quite warm enough with their quilts, especially if considering buying warmer quilts or just additional for stacking, to consider putting their old sleeping bag to use while experimenting with this method. Especially if they have those bigger bags with full length zippers. (Though I noticed Shug's bag did not have a full length zipper, and he still made it work)
    I did add a zip in extender for for zipper to give a bit more room.

    Western Mountaineering Bag Extender by Sean Emery, on Flickr

    Western Mountaineering Bag Extender by Sean Emery, on Flickr

    FOOT END
    Western Mountaineering Bag Extender by Sean Emery, on Flickr

    Hammock Pod by Sean Emery, on Flickr
    Whooooo Buddy)))) All Secure in Sector Seven

  8. #8
    New Member Pippi's Avatar
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    That's a good idea with the extender. Maybe I'll have time to test it out this weekend, before I head out on the trail Tuesday. I do have a lightweight underquilt and a top quilt. I just need to see how much I need so I don't overpack.
    Hiking my own hike and hanging my own hang. This is where my happy is!
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  9. #9
    all secure in sector 7 Shug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pippi View Post
    That's a good idea with the extender. Maybe I'll have time to test it out this weekend, before I head out on the trail Tuesday. I do have a lightweight underquilt and a top quilt. I just need to see how much I need so I don't overpack.
    Yes, this pod system is something I use for deep Winter here in Minnesota. Usually if going -25ºF or below. And usually pulling a pulk in the snow. Luckily I have several UQs and TQs to choose from. Layering UQs and TQs also works very well.
    Those bag wedge extendors are hard to find.....https://www.moosejaw.com/product/wes...ander_10090172

    Shug

    Whooooo Buddy)))) All Secure in Sector Seven

  10. #10
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shug View Post
    Yes, this pod system is something I use for deep Winter here in Minnesota. Usually if going -25ºF or below. And usually pulling a pulk in the snow. Luckily I have several UQs and TQs to choose from. Layering UQs and TQs also works very well.
    Those bag wedge extendors are hard to find.....https://www.moosejaw.com/product/wes...ander_10090172

    Shug


    Wow, I did not know this was still available! If I was not already into Superior gear insulated hammock for this year, I would be tempted to order a WM bag and this extender to go with it to rig up my own pod! Will this extender fit all WM bags?

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