20 vs 30 deg tq+uq stuffed size?

**mattnin** · 03-08-2024, 17:27

Hello, please help me decide. I'm considering the loco libre tq+uq combo. I like to sleep warm. I only backpack with lows to the 30's, rarely anything ever colder. I'm thinking a 10 degree cushion is just what I needed, so 20 degree quilts, but I'm not sure. I've never had a down quilt. Always synthetic. For example, an apex 3.6 oz tq/uq I can do 50 degrees but I'm cold, and a 7.5 oz apex tq/uq I'm chilled at 40. I want to be warm at 30 if possible. Are down quilts ratings more realistic? How does a 30 degree LL quilt work for you?

Also, my other big concern is pack size. I'm planning to do longer trips this summer with lots of elevation change so I also need to choose wisely and so not sure if a 20 degree is what I should get. It's not unreasonable for me to see the low 40s overnight in the summer here. So if anyone can share the stuffed size of the 20 degree and 30 degree tq/uq combos, I'd really appreciate it! Also, any advice or tips you may have, I'm interested!

**mattnin** · 03-10-2024, 08:43

Well nevermind lol. I am getting a pair of operators for now and will likely get a warmer set in the future. I thought that might be the best choice for me at this time especially since I want to go super light this summer.

**FLTurtle** · 03-10-2024, 20:15

Well, I have Hammock Gear quilts so ymmv...the stuff sacks for the 20F Burrow and Incubator are 8.5L each, so 17L total. On the HG site, the 30F gear comes with 5.5L stuff sacks for 11L total.

**mattnin** · 03-10-2024, 23:48

That does help. I'll bet it's close. Thanks!

**draco_1967** · 03-11-2024, 09:24

Originally Posted by mattnin

...Are down quilts ratings more realistic?

Many of the down quilt vendors give their quilts ratings for comfort, whereas the larger commercial bag companies are survival ratings. I have HG and UGQ quilts, and both are comfortable down to their rating (and even a little beyond). Of course, YMMV based on how warm or cold you sleep.

**mattnin** · 03-11-2024, 10:29

Originally Posted by draco_1967

Many of the down quilt vendors give their quilts ratings for comfort, whereas the larger commercial bag companies are survival ratings. I have HG and UGQ quilts, and both are comfortable down to their rating (and even a little beyond). Of course, YMMV based on how warm or cold you sleep.

This is what I suspect is happening. I am starting to believe that apex insulation ratings for even DIY gear also are survival ratings. Apex is not at all bad though, I love my DIY apex quilts, but I do need to figure out how I can make more space in my pack for more food and apex is very bulky. After seeing the size of the 50 degree loco libre operators in this thread, https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/...ies-Underquilt, my apex quilts for the same comfort temperature rating, 3.6oz/yd, are easily over double that size in bulk. This is pretty much the reason that I must switch over to down.

**FLTurtle** · 03-11-2024, 10:33

Yeah, if you switching from Apex to down, you should have extra room in your pack. What's your pack volume? I have a Zpacks Arc Blast, and the main is 42L. With the 20F stuff, plus winter layers, my food carry is limited compared to spring/fall.

**mattnin** · 03-11-2024, 23:22

I got a Seek Outside Divide 4800 for Christmas, 79L. It's a big external framed pack, and thank goodness it is because I took it out in January for a winter hammocking trip and my 7.5oz Apex quilts barely left any room for everything else I needed. Those quilts easily took over half the space in my pack bag plus they were simply not warm enough for 30 degree weather and so I even had to bring my ridgerest to throw in my hammock for even more insulation.