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  1. #21
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meteorharry View Post
    I'm really enjoying using a long/wide Thermarest X-Therm Max in my double layer Ridgerunner but do occasionally get cold shoulders/knees when I side sleep and I end up rolling near the edge of the pad. ...............
    Let me make absolutely sure I have understood what your complaint is:
    A: Are you talking about your knees, near the edge of the pad, are sticking out a bit beyond the edge of the pad, and contacting the edge of the hammock? Thus compressing the insulation in your top quilt ( or sleeping bag), greatly reducing it's insulation value?

    Or,
    B: are you talking about drafts that occur along the edges of your UQ, probably when the edge of the UQ lifts up and loses contact with the hammock, allowing warm air to escape? If the latter, then go with Cougarmeats thoughts about a wider tQ or even a zipped up sleeping bag. If it is the latter(drafts), adding an UQ is probably not going to help you.
    But, if it is your knees compressing the loft when they contact the edges of the hammock, I doubt a wider TQ is going to help you. No matter how wide, you will still compress that down at your knees. An UQ MIGHT help in that case(or CCF inserts at the knees under your pants). Assuming you can keep the top edge of the UQ snug up against the top edge of the hammock, while using a pad.

    So, is the problem A(contacting the edge of the hammock?) or B(drafts)?

  2. #22
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    Sure, whenever you get a chance would be great, BillyBob. Btw, I was playing around with securing the foam pads to my shins/knees as you suggested and one thing I tried that seemed ok was to pull a buff/neck gaiter over your knees and then stuff the foam inside that tube of elastic fabric. At the bottom, below the foam, I used a loop of velcro (velcro ties for lashing things to pack) to prevent the foam from slipping out (not sure if this was necessary but made it more secure).

  3. #23
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    Hi again, BillyBob. I have not been using an underquilt. I don't have one for the Ridgerunner. Sorry if my post has not been the clearest but I think the problem is likely mostly A (contacting edge of hammock with knees, arms, shoulders) that occurs when I side sleep or if I shift to edge of pad. I do think occasional drafts that get in between the fabric layers or come from the sides could also be an issue.

    I've got a trip coming up with temperatures likely to get down to the low 40s and will just have my insulated pad to bring. I plan to try the following to improve the situation:
    i.) Bring sleeping bag instead of topquilt and zip it up
    ii.) Try foam inserts at knees and possibly upper arms
    iii.) Possibly hang or stuff my rain jacket and rain kilt over ends of Ridgerunner to block breezes from getting in between the fabric layers (will only do this if they are dry).

  4. #24
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meteorharry View Post
    Hi again, BillyBob. I have not been using an underquilt. I don't have one for the Ridgerunner. Sorry if my post has not been the clearest but I think the problem is likely mostly A (contacting edge of hammock with knees, arms, shoulders) that occurs when I side sleep or if I shift to edge of pad. I do think occasional drafts that get in between the fabric layers or come from the sides could also be an issue.

    I've got a trip coming up with temperatures likely to get down to the low 40s and will just have my insulated pad to bring. I plan to try the following to improve the situation:
    i.) Bring sleeping bag instead of topquilt and zip it up
    ii.) Try foam inserts at knees and possibly upper arms
    iii.) Possibly hang or stuff my rain jacket and rain kilt over ends of Ridgerunner to block breezes from getting in between the fabric layers (will only do this if they are dry).
    Well, that approach will give you a pretty certain diagnoses. If the bag helps, it was drafts. If the inserts help, it was compression of insulation against the hammock. Of course: it could be both!

  5. #25
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    BillyBob, when you use the gathered-end underquilts with the Ridgerunner and the sides come up well above the Ridgerunner's bugnet zipper do you find it difficult or annoying to get out of the hammock? How do you go about it? Do you first need to loosen the underquilt from inside the hammock or can you just push the underquilt down and step over it and out of the hammock?

  6. #26
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meteorharry View Post
    BillyBob, when you use the gathered-end underquilts with the Ridgerunner and the sides come up well above the Ridgerunner's bugnet zipper do you find it difficult or annoying to get out of the hammock? How do you go about it? Do you first need to loosen the underquilt from inside the hammock or can you just push the underquilt down and step over it and out of the hammock?
    Harry, I can't say right off because usually, when I am using any UQ, I am not even using the bug net. But I'm pretty sure the net would not be in my way. I would just unzip it and throw my legs over the UQ, which would push it out of the way, just as it is when I get into hammock with UQ. If I get a chance I will check it out for you and report back.

    So, it did not rain yet, so I decided to put a stand up, hang the hammock and AHE quilt with the pad in the pad pocket. and get some pics for you.

    Sorry Friend, I don't think it is going to work for you. The UQ comes up to the edge of th hammock when occupied, where as most of my knee is a bit higher than that when on my side in fetal.

    This picture is me pushing down on the pad with my hand. You can see that, with the pad pushing down on the quilt, the edge of the hammock is a fair amount higher than the edge of the UQ.

    ...................................

    In this picture, in the occupied hammock, my finger is on the hard edge of the hammock. I can't really tell very well with this pic, but I think the edge of the UQ is below my fingerand the edge of the hammock. So, if my knee was on that edge, I don't think it would get any insulation fro the UQ.

    ................................

    In this picture, I am in fetal position, with the saddle bag pulled up out of the way and between my knees. You can see that my right knee is on top of the pad and above the UQ's edge.

    ..............................................

    So, if cold knees are the problem, I'm not sure how much adding this UQ is going to help much. I'd want a wider UQ that would come up high enough to be well above that hard edge of the WBRR. And I might need a shock cord mod to pull the UQ close enough to me in order to be in contact with my knees. If I get a chance later on, I'll get a picture with a wider UQ.

    I have some pics with a wider UQ in next post

  7. #27
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Greylock 4, Neoair winter pad in WBRR pad pocket

    Harry, here are some pics with wider UQ:

    Just as i previous post with custom fit UQ, I am pushing down on the pad(in pad pocket), trying to push it down into the JRB Greylock 4 UQ. Obviously, the UQ coes up well above the edge of the WBRR hammock

    ....................................
    On my back, pad in pad pocket, quilt covering sides adequately


    .......................................
    fetal position, lt knee just next to WBRR hard edge, UQ in contact with hammock


    .............................................
    fetal position, knee on top of hard ridge, knee in contact with UQ


    .......................................

    Hope that helps!

    Bill

  8. #28
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    Wow, thanks so much for those pictures, BillyBob! This is extremely helpful and very kind of you to go to the trouble to investigate. Looks like none of the commercially available underquilts for the Ridgerunner are going to give much side coverage when paired with a pad. I think you're quite right that I'll need to look into gathered end underquilts, or possibly get something custom made. Any thoughts on ideal width for this? I see the GreyLock is 42" wide (https://www.jacksrbetter.com/product/greylock-4/). Do you think that might be about the sweet spot for side coverage? I wouldn't want to carry excess weight, complicate entry/exit or totally eliminate the view from the hammock.

  9. #29
    cougarmeat's Avatar
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    Yeah know, if it's an issue with UQ/Pad coverage, and inexpensive improvement - as long as you are going the Pad route - is to buy some ReflexIt at a hardware store (Home Depot, Lowes) and cut/tape it to the exact dimensions of your DL sleeve. At least that will provide some wall-to-wall bottom coverage. Not as warm as a UQ with sufficient loft, but better than two layers of thin nylon.
    In order to see what few have seen, you must go where few have gone. And DO what few have done.

  10. #30
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    Thanks, cougarmeat. My long/wide Xtherm Max Pad is 25" wide and 2.5" thick but I'm thinking the ideal width/thickness for the double-layer Ridgerunner might be more like 27" wide and 3" thick to really fill that space. Adding a wider piece of reflectix or CCF on top of my pad (or did you mean below?) might be helpful to fill out that space and help block drafts/cold spots on edges.

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