Sorry to hear about your downfall but glab your pride is intact. You said you made new CL's- did you use the locked brummel or thru splice? Also after melting the Amsteel CL I would expect the becket hitch strap to have some damage- did it or maybe not since it is doing the slipping and the friction on the CL is the focal point not the strap- maybe?
okay, thanks for the clarification, i did have a hunch you were unlikely to have made any "basic mistakes", but we're humans, always possible to miss something.
aah, this is interesting, and it might explain something.
I was using an EVO loop on the hammock CL to use as a pull tab to ease the Beckett Hitch release. Could this have caused the hitch to slip? I don't see how.
was the evo loop just "hanging" at the apex of the becket, or was it larksheaded to the CL? either way, i think there's a possibility that it provided enough space/"lubication" for the webbing to start slipping through. the problem with dyneema is that it's self lubricating, so once it starts slipping and producing a bit of heat, things don't get any better from there on.
you might be better off using the soft shackle directly, instead of hanging it on the CL.
i think you are right, the lighter the webbing, and the more willing it is to assume the efficient rope shape, the worse knots will be. it's not that it doesn't take the becket hitch well, frankly that knot should simply be accepted as being useless in dyneema/dyneema. the reason it cut through is that dyneema has very low melting point (not much above water boiling point, about 140 centigrade iirc, and it starts to soften and lose integrity much before that, around 80-90 centigrade, which is below water boiling point). so if you get slippage in dyneema, it's very easy to reach dangerous temperatures for it, it's just a matter of how far it slips, and how fast it slips (the faster, the more energy released per second, the higher the temperature will rise, as less heat has time to dissipate in the surrounding atmosphere than is coming in from the friction).I can't help but wonder if the nature of the UHMWPE to roll up and basically act as cord on cord has anything to do with it. I know Dyneema doesn't take many knots well. But even with the slippage, I'm surprised that it cut the CL. I've never had a similar issue with my Amsteel whoopies on Amsteel CLs.
with amsteel whoopies, if something goes wrong, heat could be generated as well, but it's usually distributed better, not focused in one small area like on a CL. i think whoopies/ucr gone slidey are more likely to weld shut than to cut through (but i'm speculating a bit too much here, i haven't had it happen)
i don't think you're overthinking it, my point of view is in fact a bit more "radical"/out of the box: don't install a second CL for backup, but think of it this way instead: slippage in dyneema is unacceptable, you should eliminate slippage by design if using dyneema. either ditch the dyneema cl, and replace with something else (kevlar, or some good quality climbing rated tubular webbing), it adds some wieght, but it's not so significant in that size, and it will _really_ work for the purpose, with any suspesnion system you might want to try; or keep the nifty dyneema cl's, but ditch the becket hitch in ultra lightweight dyneema webbing (so either some honest polyester or kevlar webbing, or some other suspension system). as a side note, webbing on the hammock ends is also nice as it distributes the load on the fabric much nicer than skinny dyneema, which takes care of another valid worry in regards to safety/strength.Maybe I should install two CLs on each hammock end. That way there's a backup if one fails. Slight weight penalty for peace of mind.
Am I overthinking this?
Last edited by nanok; 06-05-2021 at 02:12.
This discussion echoes back to why I settled upon Kevlar as my choice when going the knots-only route. Polyester was good but heavy, all "flavors" of UHMWPE slipped when shock loaded (bounce test) and Mule Tape shredded even with a tiny amount of slip.
Two typical UHMWPE straps weigh about 1.7oz and two Kevlar straps about 2.7oz ... I can easily make up that oz somewhere else in my kit.
Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ)
“If everybody is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ~ Gen. George S Patton
Kevlar 3.3 has a little less stretch than Venom or Myerstech (early version... I've not tried the latest stuff) although not by much. UHMWPE is amazing stuff and if I were using J-Bend I'd stay with that material.
Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ)
“If everybody is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ~ Gen. George S Patton
I have those straps and they have never slipped on me, but they do tear up my fingers when releasing the becket. I would imagine they can do quite a number on the CL during a slip of any sort.
I switched back to his lightweight polyester straps. They are perfect for me. Lightweight, easy to pack, effortless tie and untie of the becket and I just don’t worry about them.
Last edited by Tpatter; 06-04-2021 at 13:09.
Was this to me? If so do you mean the kevlars or Myers' straps tear up for your fingers? I haven't experienced this myself with my Myers' straps. These are the ones I have (2.9gpf):
180283732_839206806676044_2293031296955890916_n.jpg
Bookmarks