Down booties?

[jamie shard]

I just want to say that during home testing and at the WI frozen butt hang n(negative single digits Fahrenheit and wind) I tried using a foam pad underneath my feet and just thin liner socks and I was the toastiest I've ever been. For me, having the foot end of the hammock higher (and warm air goes up), plus the non-compressible insulation of the foam pad, made for the warmest happiest feet I've ever had.

When you insulate your feet in booties you are 100% relying on inside-to-out warmth. When you are bootie-less, you get the benefit of all the warmth inside the sleeping bag. Obviously both approaches will work, but try the foam pad route before thinking you need booties.

-jamie

p.s. that said, I used my down booties for walking around camp!

[unionmanbirch]

I have been using the down socks from Goosefeet for a couple years. What I have found is that if my feet are even a little bit cold when I put them on, my feet will not warm up. If my feet are warm when I put them on, they stay warm. One night one of the down socks fell off in my underquilt overnight and I didn't even notice. I still use them when it is cold out, but I'm not sure it is anything more than a placebo effect.

[Shug]

Make sure your feet are warm when you crawl n for the night. Only way to sleep through the night with toasty toes.

[BizzyBee]

If you haven't already purchased...another brand to consider is Feathered Friends. My wife is always cold and these were a game changer for her. They crush down to nothing and can be worn walking around camp as well.

[WV]

I've been making insulated booties for myself and some relatives recently, based on a pattern for lined fleece booties. I used fleece with a silk lining for the first pair. They have served well at Mt. Rogers hangs. They're nice and loose, which is good, but I had to add a 1/16" bungee loop at the top to keep them from sliding off in the night. The next pair were 1.1 oz. nylon taffeta with four layers, because both the outer layer and the lining were stuffed with down (sewn through to stabilize the down, but the seams were offset between the outer layer and the lining). These are very warm, despite weighing only 3.15 ounces. I used some 1/2 ounce nylon ripstop for the liners. Several times I've had to take them off during the night because my feet were sweating. (I haven't experimented with vapor barriers, but would be tempted to just use sylnylon for the linings of a pair of insulated socks. I guess I'd have to go north with Shug to test them.) The next several pairs were all done with 1.1 nylon taffeta ("Ion") and a single layer of 6 oz. Primaloft Silver. This is a great combination. A pair of size 12's also weigh 3.15 ounces (purely coincidental), despite being much bigger and using heavier materials (though needing only 2 layers of fabric). The same materials used for a pair the same size as the down socks weigh 2.5 ounces. These are my go-to socks for sleeping, at present. If I could find it, I would use 3 oz. Primaloft. These half dozen pairs have exhausted my supply of 6 oz. Primaloft, so I may be forced to try Climashield, which is better suited to thicker layers, like quilts. I may offer a pair on the For Trade thread soon - insulated socks for Primaloft.
Here are the size 12's.
Syb's socks.jpg
Here are my socks (roughly size 9-10). The down socks are red. The gray ones are Primaloft. These were made with the calendered side out, but I usually don't do that. Theoretically the Primaloft fibers are small enough that you have to treat them like down, but I haven't seen any sticking out.
insulated sock-boots - 2 pair.jpg
These are nice and soft and supple, like socks. To get them to stand up for a photo, you have to insert a TV remote.

[Papasmokes]

I wear the Zpacks possum socks which keep my feet nice and toasty, so I've never seen a need for down booties personally.

[Darbe]

Like Norfolk Yeti and somewhat like Shugs idea but I bring the coat into the hammock and slide my feet into the foot box of my quilt and then the quilt into the jacket. Only time I've had cold feet was no jacket on and the UQ slid off to one side and that foot got chilly. Negative single digits. I always wear a good pair of socks thickness depends on the weather.
Now if I could come up with some warm enough gloves or mittens for during the day I'll be set for next winter.

[BillyBob58]

That looks good, but to large for motorcycle camping. Space is a premium.

Sent from my couch

Might be my ignorance….We’re your Wool socks tight? Fresh? Over sized? Try a pair of liners and over sized(fluffy) dry wool socks before bed. If it’s COLD I recommend Wiggys Booties. … I also get cold feet. My first time in a hammock…..I slept in USMC Happy Suit Booties(synthetic primaloft), as welll as the bottoms to the set and a wool shirt, micro down jacket and Outdoor Research ProGloves the two part one in 20° with powder snow and ice all around. Had a UQ and a Sleeping bag….. I felt like my feet were frozen solid. Realized they were above the UQ and in the top of my hammock. Soooo cold. I think I might have had to much insulation and was getting cooled from the sweat. It’s a learning curve for sure.

OK, heads up: here comes Mr. Weirdo. For some reason I always end up doing many things so differently than most other folks, and it works for me. So take anything I say with a large grain of salt.

First of all, while I have had a few frozen butts in a hammock, and a couple of just overall cold situations, I don't ever recall having cold feet, not a single time in the last 15 years. Now, most likely, during some of my cold times - even shivering during the learning curve- I also had me some cold feet. But, I was so cold in other parts, perhaps I simply did not notice my feet? Maybe, who knows. But generally speaking, cold feet are just not a problem for me.

Next, if " Space is a premium ", or even if it is not, or if you were "getting cooled from the sweat.", consider vapor barrier(VB) socks NEXT to or CLOSE to your skin. Nothing quite matches this as it has so many benefits for very little weight and no thicker than a pair of nylon daily wear socks. Experiment with free WM grocery or bread bags. What do you have to lose with a no cost experiment?

As for booties, I have an ancient pair of REI synthetic booties with CCG foot section for walking around camp. These might be the same ones Shug uses? Any way, I have only used them- in a hammock at least- once about 7 years ago when I set my all time personal low of +6F. (I just have not been able to break below zero down here in MS, not since I have been a hanger, DANG IT! ) But, my feet were not only not cold but overheating bad because I was also using my secret method that most folks refuse to even consider- vapor barrier(VB) socks next to my feet, and probably(not sure) under a loose layer of wool hiking socks, and all inside my REI synthetic down booties. All on top of the HHSS OCF pad and a cut down WM blue/sit pad. With my feet(and booties and VB socks) inside a 30F TQ foot box.

Also not hurting anything was lots of head insulation. A nice thick down hood, at least equal in warmth rating to my TQ and HHSS under insulation. A brain that is slightly overheated will shunt warm blood to the extremities(hands and feet).

Results? In the lowly HHSS + sit pad and a TQ that was probably about a 30F TQ(weight 20 oz long wide), my feet were significantly over heating and sweating. I should have pulled the REI booties off, or maybe the VB socks, something, but I was to cozy to come out of my cocoon to try and remove them. If I had not had on the VB socks, I would have made the effort to in order to keep the sweat out of my down insulation. But I didn't, and except for right next to my skin, all was bone dry the next morning. A southern boy warm at dry, head to toe, at +6F, using a 30F TQ. When have you heard of anyone's feet sweating at +6F, and without any issues regarding moisture getting into the foot box of the TQ causing cold? I have not. I suspect my feet would have been fine at minus 10 or minus 20F. Maybe no longer sweating, but warm enough.

Now, fast forward to the week before Christmas in the NC mountains at 3500 ft. The forecast low was from teens to 20, and wind was a problem on the porch I was sleeping on(no tarp or UQP). I had a very conservatively rated Superior Gear insulated hammock, and a 30F rated Sierra Madre TQ(with built in hood!). Since I did not want to bother with my tarp, I was paranoid so I layered up. No wool socks, just the nylon socks I had worn all day. No booties. I placed my UL down jacket AROUND my hammock and footbox, Shug style. In the foot box of my 30F rated TQ, I placed my thin AHE CCF foot pad. No wool socks, just my daily wear of thin nylon socks. No VB socks. Again, it was windy, but no tarp or UQP.

For upper body: I was wearing cotton PJs and a cotton shirt. Over that I placed my OR WPB rain gear(as a fake VB) with the TQ's built in hood over my head. Over that, I put my 12 oz total weight hooded Climashield jacket and 8 oz Climashield pants. No long Johns., just cotton PJs. Using "breathable" rain gear as a fake VB but no VBs on my feet except for the AHE sit pad.

Result? After a few hours, I woke up quite hot and needed to vent. My feet and head were particularly hot and starting to sweat. I reached down and pulled the foot pad out. I realized my head was uncomfortably hot, so I pulled down the hood on the TQ and tucked it round my neck, now only wearing the thin nylon hood of my WPB rain jacket. No cap or hat.

I was amazed at how long I stayed warm after removing pad and hood. My head felt much better except for my ears were a little cold. Some of the local farm animals were waking me up making a lot of noise, I had forgot my earplugs. I still needed to remove some layers, probably most of all needed to remove my fake VBs. I realized that, with all the animal racket, and especially if I got up to remove layers, I was going to be a long time getting back to sleep. But, as warm as I was- too darn hot and sweating actually- I knew I was going to make it with ease, even if it hit 18F, so I bailed about 0200 or 0300, at 25F. (maybe 27 or 28 when I climbed in a 3 or 4 hours earlier.)

So, regarding foot warmth: despite no VB socks, at about 25F in the footbox of a 30F TQ, by adding a not very thick AHE foot pad(also a VB BTW) INSIDE the TQ footbox and using Shug's technique of wrapping a very light weight down jacket around the foot of the hammock and TQ footbox, my feet were way TOO WARM. Had to remove the pad after a couple of hours, and the down hood, and was still too warm, though much better!

Now, everything I tend to do is the opposite of what I so often read here about not adding anything between you and the quilts and thus keeping them from doing their job. Along with maintaining maximum breathability. I add layers and often limit breathability(VBs), like this foot pad. But I'm sure those opposite approaches work for others, HYOH etc. But, you might want to consider experimenting with some other approaches. Although, Shug's insulated jacket around footbox and hammock is still a breathable approach. His trick of a pad inside the footbox is not. And it(or both) works bigly.

I will say this, for those that seem to say that usually adding layers will prevent your quilts from doing their job: I see a lot of posts here where adding booties has boosted foot warmth tremendously. Well, are those booties not preventing your footbox from doing it's job? Who knows, just food for thought, YMMV and HYOH. But I don't even know what it is to have cold feet in a hammock. Good luck on finding a solution! Keep trying and I bet you will!

Sorry, I know I have posted most of this before, heck, maybe even in this thread. But I just see so many folks here with cold feet over the years, and it seems unnecessary. But, then gain, people differ. So, YMMV as always.

[Rhody Seth]

I purchased the down socks (booties) from Goosefeat Gear last year and they do keep my feet warm.

[WV]

BillyBob58, you're not a weirdo, just an alternate (and possibly superior) branch on the hammocking evolutionary tree. Oh, ye hammockers, your eventual solutions may be different from BillyBob's, but ignore his underlying reasoning at your peril!

It could be hypothesized that there is a correlation between short attention spans and cold feet, but the jury's still out on that one ....