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  1. #21
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    The JRB Mt. Washington 3 is an UQ right? The Kammok is a TQ, UQ, Blanket. I suppose the JRB could also be a blanket. I'm primarily replacing my 28* down sleeping bag so TQ is the main function.

  2. #22
    Senior Member cmoulder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by justinae View Post
    Anyone familiar with the KAMMOK Firebelly Trail Quilt? It ticks a lot of boxes for me in terms of versatility.

    https://kammok.com/products/firebell...kpacking-quilt
    28.5oz is quite heavy nowadays for a 30deg quilt.

    Versatility might be good but maybe not. It's like a 'hybrid' bicycle that has some things in common with road bikes and other things similar to mountain bikes, but does nothing really well.
    Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ)
    “If everybody is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ~ Gen. George S Patton

  3. #23
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    Yeah I considered the tradeoff of versatility but there will be plenty of times it will be nice to have a blanket for my kids or if I buy some other gear to test (naturally) and want to use this as an UQ, etc. I tend to lean versatile over singular on most stuff and like it.

    The closest piece with versatility I can find is the EE Revelation but they're on quite a back order.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by justinae View Post
    The JRB Mt. Washington 3 is an UQ right? The Kammok is a TQ, UQ, Blanket. I suppose the JRB could also be a blanket. I'm primarily replacing my 28* down sleeping bag so TQ is the main function.
    My fault, I meant to steer you to the Hudson River 20 as the multi function quilt. Still about 7 oz lighter (in size Regular), and actually now $40 cheaper than the Kammock product.

    https://www.jacksrbetter.com/product...hammock-quilt/

  5. #25
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    Given that JRB says they conservatively rate their bags and include 25% overstuff on all do you think the Sierra Stealth (rated at 40*) gets closer to that 30* mark?

    https://www.jacksrbetter.com/product/sierra-stealth/

  6. #26
    cmc4free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by justinae View Post
    Given that JRB says they conservatively rate their bags and include 25% overstuff on all do you think the Sierra Stealth (rated at 40*) gets closer to that 30* mark?

    https://www.jacksrbetter.com/product/sierra-stealth/
    That's a bit of a rabbit hole, and I'll try to keep it brief, but I am of the opinion that overstuff doesn't make a 30° quilt into a 25° quilt. Overstuff won't change the maximum loft of the quilt, which is limited by the fabric shells and mesh baffles that make up its construction. Assuming a quilt is fully lofted and doesn't have empty spots, cramming more down in won't likely make it any better at retaining your body heat. It does provide insurance against loss of down performance in the field, for example if the down loses loft from taking on moisture over the course of a multi day trip. Having more down overstuffed in there will keep the quilt fully lofted that much longer as the down starts to lose its optimum performance until it's dried out or laundered. It also gives you more to play with for intentional down migration.

    But to some extent, whether the above holds true depends on how generous a particular vendor is with the down in the first place. Overstuff would be more valuable if the quilt maker was skimping on down in the first place - but then it wouldn't really be overstuff, would it? All the vendors that are popular around here are pretty well known for being generous with the down they use in their products. I couldn't include Kammock among those because they aren't discussed a lot here. But that's also why I mentioned in my first post that I like to know the fill weight (not just fill type). You can compare one vendor against another for like-sized, like-rated quilts and see which one might be using more or less down than others. Again, around here the consensus is that pretty much all the cottage vendors are generous with the fill. And yet folks still get overstuff.

    TL/DR Would the JRB Stealth work for you as a 30° TQ? Hard to say. Not knowing much about you and your preferences, my first instinct would be to say probably not. But it all depends on your resting metabolism, what kind of food you eat before sleeping, what you wear to sleep, whether you have protection from the wind, and on and on...
    Last edited by cmc4free; 08-13-2020 at 15:05.

  7. #27
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    That has to be one of the most useful forum replies I've ever read. Thank you. Here in PNW any given night could easily start out as a 30-40* bag night and switch to a 20* bag night. I tend to make up the difference with thermal layers and a hat rather then put all the work on the bag/quilt. But I've got 30 years of tent/pad/bag experience and almost nill hammock/quilts experience. I tend to sleep cold but I just can't imagine using 20* quilts in August and I don't have a multi cottage quilt budget.

    Just gotta get one and start testing. If it weren't for lead times I think I'd be all over the 30* EE Revelation.

  8. #28
    cmc4free's Avatar
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    Have you looked at these with the zippered footbox? Not going to work easily as an UQ, but it can do quilt/blanket.

    https://hammockgear.com/economy-burrow-custom/

    Edit: Yeah, sorry... again... lead times.

  9. #29
    Senior Member cmoulder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmc4free View Post
    That's a bit of a rabbit hole, and I'll try to keep it brief, but I am of the opinion that overstuff doesn't make a 30° quilt into a 25° quilt. Overstuff won't change the maximum loft of the quilt, which is limited by the fabric shells and mesh baffles that make up its construction. Assuming a quilt is fully lofted and doesn't have empty spots, cramming more down in won't likely make it any better at retaining your body heat. It does provide insurance against loss of down performance in the field, for example if the down loses loft from taking on moisture over the course of a multi day trip. Having more down overstuffed in there will keep the quilt fully lofted that much longer as the down starts to lose its optimum performance until it's dried out or laundered. It also gives you more to play with for intentional down migration.

    But to some extent, whether the above holds true depends on how generous a particular vendor is with the down in the first place. Overstuff would be more valuable if the quilt maker was skimping on down in the first place - but then it wouldn't really be overstuff, would it? All the vendors that are popular around here are pretty well known for being generous with the down they use in their products. I couldn't include Kammock among those because they aren't discussed a lot here. But that's also why I mentioned in my first post that I like to know the fill weight (not just fill type). You can compare one vendor against another for like-sized, like-rated quilts and see which one might be using more or less down than others. Again, around here the consensus is that pretty much all the cottage vendors are generous with the fill. And yet folks still get overstuff.

    TL/DR Would the JRB Stealth work for you as a 30° TQ? Hard to say. Not knowing much about you and your preferences, my first instinct would be to say probably not. But it all depends on your resting metabolism, what kind of food you eat before sleeping, what you wear to sleep, whether you have protection from the wind, and on and on...
    Wow, well stated... dead-bang on!

    This should be a STICKY as the most concise explanation ever.
    Five Basic Principles of Going Lighter (not me... the great Cam Honan of OZ)
    “If everybody is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” ~ Gen. George S Patton

  10. #30
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    agreed 100%!

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