Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 21
  1. #11
    Phantom Grappler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Denton NC
    Hammock
    WildernessLogics 12x6
    Tarp
    HG cuben 13ridge12
    Insulation
    TopQuiltUnderQuilt
    Suspension
    S and D
    Posts
    4,926
    I agree, if reversed, it would work better
    Amsteel continuous loop and strap.
    If you want to try again with your current rigging...
    After you tie becket hitch. Add a slip knot about an inch from becket hitch exit.
    Slip knot is tied on side of bunny rabbit ear that does not initially move when ripcord
    is pulled. This would be as soon as becket is exited.

    A slip knot can be added at the exit of a great many knots and splices,
    to prevent failure—slipping! The slip knot when called upon by slipping,
    bumps into the knot but usually can’t be pulled through bury or knot!
    Kinda puts the brakes on things.

  2. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    old dirt
    Posts
    444
    one must see knots slipping in dyneema under load, to believe it. the first feeling you get, if you're a knot person, is your heart sinks "it is over. the world as we know it has ended. this knot does NOT slip, it cannot be". the becket hitch/sheet bend is particularly notorious for this, as it is such a simple (low contact surface) knot (and this includes the bowline, which has the same topology). one of the peculiarities of dyneema is that it is self lubricating, this is something which can't be grasped by holding it in your hand, the first time i loaded a knot in dyneema all i could think of was "you weren't kidding...". it's mindboggling, but it's here, it's as close to alien tech as we've ever been when it comes to rope, i think. remember the good folks at igkt spent years, literally, to find knots that work reasonably well in dyneema, and basically gave up on finding a bend that works. (e.starzinger did come up with the estar hitch though, but that's about it). and igkt to knots is what cern is to physics (okay, maybe that's a bit too much of a stretch, but you get it).

  3. #13
    Phantom Grappler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Denton NC
    Hammock
    WildernessLogics 12x6
    Tarp
    HG cuben 13ridge12
    Insulation
    TopQuiltUnderQuilt
    Suspension
    S and D
    Posts
    4,926
    To tie two lengths of amsteel together and use it as your hammock suspension. I recommend these two “knots”
    I believe neither one slips or jams!

    Slipped zeppelin bend. Easy to get sidetracked and tie any of several other interlocking overhand knots. The wrong ones can jam real easy! Slipped zeppelin bend can also be used to tie amsteel to tree strap!

    The second “knot” is one you already know. Marlin spike hitch is good for amsteel to amsteel and amsteel to strap.
    As you know it does not slip and does not jam.
    To tie, put both ropes in palm of hand. The two short ends-loose ends hang loose from palm near pinky finger—with about a foot of loose ends both parallel. Both long ends extend from top of palm near pointer finger. Ropes are parallel-side by side. (Later one goes to hammock, other goes to tree) tie marlin spike hitch with both at same time.
    Insert toggle-this toggle must be sturdy and crush proof. No twigs here. After hand tightening marlin spike hitch, one goes straight to tree, while other goes back to hammock.

  4. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    old dirt
    Posts
    444
    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Grappler View Post
    To tie two lengths of amsteel together and use it as your hammock suspension. I recommend these two “knots”
    I believe neither one slips or jams!

    Slipped zeppelin bend. Easy to get sidetracked and tie any of several other interlocking overhand knots. The wrong ones can jam real easy! Slipped zeppelin bend can also be used to tie amsteel to tree strap!
    (...)
    the zeppelin is one of my favourite knots, and quite popular with knot afficiandos. it was one of the first knots thoroughly tested in dyneema, it slides at relatively light loads.

  5. #15
    Phantom Grappler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Denton NC
    Hammock
    WildernessLogics 12x6
    Tarp
    HG cuben 13ridge12
    Insulation
    TopQuiltUnderQuilt
    Suspension
    S and D
    Posts
    4,926
    Quote Originally Posted by nanok View Post
    the zeppelin is one of my favourite knots, and quite popular with knot afficiandos. it was one of the first knots thoroughly tested in dyneema, it slides at relatively light loads.
    If zeppelin bend slips, then I been lying a long time. Oops!
    Sorry about that, I’ve never seen it slip, then again it matches
    up good with the other lies I tell.

    Further study may be required on my part.

  6. #16
    Tacoma96's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Clayton, NC
    Hammock
    WBBB, RR, Eno Dn
    Tarp
    WB SF, CB
    Insulation
    WB Mamba, UGQUQ
    Suspension
    Whoopies, D Clips
    Posts
    2,719
    yes the zeppelin bend is one of my favorites.
    Straight out of Clayton.

    Most physical hike: Grandfather Mountain, NC. Aug 13.

    I don't need to make my pack lighter. I need to make my (_*_) lighter.

  7. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    old dirt
    Posts
    444
    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Grappler View Post
    If zeppelin bend slips, then I been lying a long time. Oops!
    Sorry about that, I’ve never seen it slip, then again it matches
    up good with the other lies I tell.

    Further study may be required on my part.
    don't feel too bad. i didn't believe it when i heard it either. it's only in dyneema, in good old honest rope of any other kind, "what we know is true". dyneema is not rope in that sense. basically every bend we knew of before dyneema was invented will slip in dyneema at very low relative loads. the reason why you might think that's not the case is because we tend to use dyneema for hammock purposes "oversized"/with high safety factor (as we should), which means in normal use we don't really get that near to the capacity of the line (which is as it should be). this means that when you make a zeppelin on a 3mm dyneema line that has a rated mean break strength of about 900kgf, when you sit in your hammock to test it you will load it to about 10% of that, which is just short of the 15-20% required so it starts slipping (from memory, might be different for the zepp), but still far enough that you won't see any sign of trouble. unfortunately, although all looks good, you're now hanging with nearly no safety margin, and you feel safe thinking you're close to 10/1. it pays to be careful with these things, especially when alien tech rope is involved

  8. #18
    Phantom Grappler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Denton NC
    Hammock
    WildernessLogics 12x6
    Tarp
    HG cuben 13ridge12
    Insulation
    TopQuiltUnderQuilt
    Suspension
    S and D
    Posts
    4,926
    If I ever have a slipped zeppelin bend slip, then I will add a slip knot in the bunny rabbit ears one inch from “knot” exit. I believe the slip knot if called upon will put the brakes on any letdown.

    This is a Phantom guess. I’ve made some videos on YouTube.
    David Hughes Phantom Grappler’s recommended ties part one and part two.
    Somewhere in there you might find the slip knot placed in bunny rabbit ear, that I’ve described.

    Also, suppose you are hanging on UCR. You can add a slip knot to amsteel one inch from bury exit.
    If UCR gets bumped and begins to slip, Would the slip knot not get pulled into the bury?
    I can be wrong?!?! I risk being wrong by guessing 4 the right answer.
    Nothing guessed, nothing gained....

  9. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    old dirt
    Posts
    444
    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Grappler View Post
    If I ever have a slipped zeppelin bend slip, then I will add a slip knot in the bunny rabbit ears one inch from “knot” exit. I believe the slip knot if called upon will put the brakes on any letdown.

    This is a Phantom guess. I’ve made some videos on YouTube.
    David Hughes Phantom Grappler’s recommended ties part one and part two.
    Somewhere in there you might find the slip knot placed in bunny rabbit ear, that I’ve described.

    Also, suppose you are hanging on UCR. You can add a slip knot to amsteel one inch from bury exit.
    If UCR gets bumped and begins to slip, Would the slip knot not get pulled into the bury?
    I can be wrong?!?! I risk being wrong by guessing 4 the right answer.
    Nothing guessed, nothing gained....
    unfortunately, guessing is all we have. afaik there's sadly still no proper mathemathical model to deal with knots in rope, and this is what dyneema partly showed us. in this case i think we need to remember how little friction there is in dyneema, which means all tension tends to be transferred along the fibre rather than across. in this example, your slipped knot will not pull into the burry of course, it will just run along it's shape, but without making any difference weather it was tied in the first place or not. at least that is my guess. when it comes to a burry of a ucr though, it's a bit worse, because it will bunch it up as it does so, and make it less rather than more effective, think of it as trading the whole length of a burry in dyneema for the few square milimieters of a half hitch. not much of a trade :/

  10. #20
    Phantom Grappler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Denton NC
    Hammock
    WildernessLogics 12x6
    Tarp
    HG cuben 13ridge12
    Insulation
    TopQuiltUnderQuilt
    Suspension
    S and D
    Posts
    4,926
    My YouTube videos
    David Hughes
    Phantom Grapplers Recommended Ties part 1 and part 2
    Slipped Zeppelin bend at 5:22 in part 1
    Carolina becket with slip knot in bunny rabbit ear at 4:10 in part 2

    A slipknot is an overhand knot that is slipped (with a bunny rabbit ear)
    Both slipknot and overhand knot resist slipping down the rope.
    A slipped half hitch is often called a slipknot But It Ain’t
    A slipped half hitch will slip if you look at it sideways!

    I believe slipped Zeppelin bend and Carolina becket are highly resistant to both slipping and jamming. And they will be reliable for normal hammock hanging—if they are tied correctly and hand tightened with a powerful grip.

    Also when describing steps of Carolina becket, I said slipped half hitch—this was just last step in hitch. A Carolina becket hitch and a regular becket hitch have similar topology to a slipped sheet bend.
    Anyone can try these “knots” and see if they hold without slipping.

    I can be wrong. And would like to see videos of zeppelin bends slipping when tied in amsteel.
    IGKT has some great knot wizards.
    Happy knotting!
    Last edited by Phantom Grappler; 08-05-2020 at 19:34.

  • + New Posts
  • Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

    Similar Threads

    1. Knot gurus... what knot is this?
      By cmoulder in forum Suspension Systems, Ridgelines, & Bug Nets
      Replies: 25
      Last Post: 07-25-2020, 07:11
    2. DIY Prusik Knot....it's been around a while. Good Knot slider.
      By Ridge_Dog in forum Suspension Systems, Ridgelines, & Bug Nets
      Replies: 0
      Last Post: 07-12-2015, 17:02
    3. total newbie from Ky.
      By Fatman hunting in forum Introduce Yourself
      Replies: 14
      Last Post: 07-23-2014, 17:24
    4. Replies: 19
      Last Post: 10-22-2010, 00:17
    5. Total Transition
      By hacktorious in forum General Hammock Talk
      Replies: 1
      Last Post: 09-27-2009, 09:04

    Bookmarks

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •