Tarp tie outs for winter below freezing

[kjune]

This thread ended with discussions for winter tarp tie outs,

https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/...-tarp-tie-outs


but I wanted a thread specifically for winter tarp tie outs. I want to optimize for gloves, and ideally, mittens. My hands get really cold fast when I'm static, and then they take forever to warm back up, so I'm looking for zero exposed skin at any point during setup and take down. I was out this weekend in the Whites with temps between 10 and 30, using a Superfly with Derek Hansen's biner/prusik CRL and Andrew Skurka's "McCarthy hitch" for the tie outs and neither were satisfactory for gloves, and impossible with mittens. With the gloves, I had to use my teeth to pull the lines at some point, and even simple hitches snagged on the gloves (and they were not thick gloves, just OR versa liners used without their shells -- I would like to keep the shells on to limit convective heat loss).

The thread above mentioned Line Loc3 -- I have these on one my tarps and like them. How well do they work when iced-over/frozen though? I am also open to hardware, but they must be semi-impossible to lose in the snow. The Tarp Tick and similar look kind of fiddly for winter use.

What do you use for winter?

[michigandave]

I'm a big fan of the line loc 3 and have them on all 4 of my tarps plus my hot tent. Here in Michigan, I get out year round. I have had some issues with the line locs icing up, but that's easily solved by knocking them with a stick or even just breathing on them to loosen it up. In winter, I usually use wool "hobo" gloves with a thin liner for when I set up, then have a pair of mittens or chemical handwarmer at the ready for a quick warmup.

[OneClick]

A quick tap or shake like Dave said. I haven't heard of anyone breaking them, but I'm sure it's possible the colder it gets. That little gate the cord goes over is TINY, but seems strong for how thin it is.

Regarding hands, sometimes they just need to be exposed. Having a heat source, even your stove on low for 10 seconds, can make all the difference heating up your hands and drying you gloves. I ran mine inside my buttoned-up tarp last weekend and just having a little heat to put my face over and dry gloves was a huge morale booster to get me back into the game.

[Shug]

Here is what I use on my Winter tarps here in Minnesota.
Line locks and S-biners.
Shug

[kjune]

Does a line loc tensioning system work well using dead man anchors? The line locs on my REI tarp are integrated with buckles on the tie outs, else I'd tried to move them over. What I like most about the Skurka system is its flexibility and simplicity; I just wished i could tolerate having hands exposed better. I din't bring chemical warmers on purpose -- 'cause what if I relied on them and ran out? But I'm going to overcompensate and bring a ton the next time. A little stove under the tarp does make a huge difference -- I was actually thinking "hmmm .... a hot tent" at one point.

I can't really overstate how much of a problem cold hands are for me. I had 5 pairs of mittens/gloves with me, but nothing really worked when relying on the simplest of knots.

[kjune]

Shug!!! Thank you for the link and all the videos. I will check out that system for sure. It does seem like line locs are the way to go. BTW, I have no idea how you do anything at -40F. I grew up in MN (U of M), and I've been back to visit when temperature out is -25. True story: my dog would rather hold it than go out at those temps.

[OneClick]

I can't really overstate how much of a problem cold hands are for me. I had 5 pairs of mittens/gloves with me, but nothing really worked when relying on the simplest of knots.

I gave up on the dexterity/warmth thing. When working with firewood, snow, other work it's 100% waterproof PVC gloves. Gotta keep the insulating gloves clean and dry. Everything else is thin-medium thickness wool or poly gloves. Mitten over the top when it's really cold. In my gear room I have a big 56L tote overflowing with gloves and mittens; still no magic solution with all that.

There are times when I had to go bare-handed for picking tiny knots, fixing jammed zipper, etc. It can be downright painful in the cold wind. You can tuck your gloves inside your shirt instead of pockets to keep them even warmer. Pop them back on and do some aggressive "chops" with your hands to get the blood moving.

[JPCPAT]

I use Line Loc 3's year round. I really am a knot guy, but the hardware is just so much easier. No issues with gloves. I did have a freezing rain freeze solid overnight last year with no issues, and no need to de-glove.

I'll note that my tarp tie out lines are either 1.75 dyneema of 2.0 Poly, and neither absorbs water to speak of. If I were using something (like nylon) that absorbs water and freezes, it might have been a different story.

One unsolicited tip: If you're burying a deadman anchor in the snow, You can use a stick, then make a big loop around the stick and knot it back to itself outside the snow pile. When it's time to break camp, release the knot, take the line and leave the stick.

[kjune]

Thank you for all the suggestions and tips. As usual, too many choices! I'm just going to go with line loc 3 + loop and 2 mm cordage from z-packs. Going to snip off the D-rings and attach them directly to the tarp tie outs. For the stake-end, an eye loop, plus little aluminum hooks. The eye loops are for the stakes. The little hooks are for the branches, roots, and deadman anchors. I'm also going to ditch the CRL and use this same set up for ridge line -- two line setup with enough length for a split V. For a clean look I'll spice the eye loops instead of tying them off -- once I verify that hooks don't get in the way too much.

[cmoulder]

I've been using Blake's hitch with Lawson Glowire for a few years with no problems. It stays tied at the tarp end so no need to re-tie, and I use MSH at the stake end.