Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 23
  1. #11
    Senior Member Monkeyboy42's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Salisbury, md
    Hammock
    DIY gathered end
    Tarp
    DIY silpoly 11x10
    Insulation
    DIY down TQ, WL UQ
    Suspension
    cinch buckles
    Posts
    705
    Quote Originally Posted by Trambo View Post
    Thanks Monkey, you're right. I don't know where I got the 5 from. I looked at the two kits that I was referencing, and they are 7 and 8 yards each. That's another of my calculations that's quite far off (but looking at the weight versus cost value is still the same ratio - just more square feet).

    8 yards = 13.33 square yards
    Ahh... makes sense now. The tarp is an economics vs weight vs bulk discussion. The grizbeaks cloud it a little further. Silpoly costs less, but weights more. Ruben weighs less, but takes a little more pack space, and costs waaayyyy more. If you can afford the cuben the weight vs bulk is an easy trade off for most people.

    Grizz beaks: are you carrying them the whole time, or just at specific times? If you carrying the whole time, you should do a tarp with doors, or a rectangular that can be pitched with doors (with smaller living space, but a little less weight). If there's only a few legs where you need doors do the grizz beams. If you do cuben I'd just do the tarp with doors regardless, given the weight difference is pretty small.

  2. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    South Texas
    Hammock
    11 foot gathered hexon1.7
    Tarp
    11 ft winter dutch
    Insulation
    TQ and UQ
    Suspension
    Spider Straps 1.5
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by Monkeyboy42 View Post

    Grizz beaks: are you carrying them the whole time, or just at specific times?
    First, I plan to only carry a beak to enclose a single side of the tent. It's my idea that I won't need this grizz beak very often. This will allow me to use it for other things. It can be a ground cloth for me, a sun shade, or I can set up some odd enclosed porch design by propping up the tarp with a pole. I feel having it on the tarp is different than being able to mail the beak home. Modularity also would allow the other grizz side to be mailed to me, if a big storm was incoming or something.

    I had a spare piece of nylon laying around, which was just a bit larger than the two grizz beak design. Since I didn't want to cut off just a few inches of fabric, I tried these oversized grizz beaks. I wanted to compare the grizz beak size to a rain kilt size. I was surprised to see that the one grizz beak (half of the two beaks needed to enclose one end) was just a tad larger than rain skirt size. Also, where people traditionally use two parts to form a single beak on an end, I am thinking of using just a half of a beak total. I think that this single piece, could be positioned to block the majority of the weather. To me, this is a decent tradeoff between the two most popular camps of winter tarp or hex cut tarp. I also like the idea of a single piece added on to the tarp, which can be used for many different functions.

    I had a blast trimming down my Static V from 11 ounces to 4 ounces. I'm considering not taking the pad, but a small Reflectix piece weighing about 1 ounce. I don't think that I'll DIY a hammock, as I can just purchase one for not too much. Since I have a few more pieces of gear to make, I'm considering selling a bunch of my other gear. That's a tough part, when you see how little that you actually need yourself .... and you compare it to the gear that you have.

  3. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    pryor,okla.
    Posts
    610
    Quote Originally Posted by Trambo View Post
    Yes, I see what you are talking about there. I'm using the calculation as though each hammock was 3.5 square yards, rather than computing how many square yards of fabric that come when ordering a 3.5 yard length.

    Also, I understand that I'll have to order in full yard increments, but I was attempting to find weight and cost values here, so I was using the 3.5 yard number rather than 4. Doing the calculations for area, it's 5.83 square yards for a hammock.

    My calculations are a tiny bit off, because I'm using 10.5 foot fabric blank (which needs to be more to be an 11 foot hammock with gathered ends). I'm not sure how much extra is needed, but I'm going to assume that 3 or 4 inches extra is adequate. I'm using a length of 136 inches along with the standard width of 60 inches. Using these more accurate numbers shows 6.3 square feet of fabric for a hammock.

    At 6.3 square feet, the fabric could weigh just 4.7 ounces for a full 11 foot hammock. I now have to redo my calculations above to factor in real square footage.
    In checking your hammock math--- 136" length x 60" width = 8160 sq." then dividing by 144 sq." (1 sq. ft.) = 56.67 sq. ft. divided by 9sq.ft. (1 sq. yd.) =6.3sq.yd.

  4. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    South Texas
    Hammock
    11 foot gathered hexon1.7
    Tarp
    11 ft winter dutch
    Insulation
    TQ and UQ
    Suspension
    Spider Straps 1.5
    Posts
    591
    To be honest, I just throw it into a calculator like https://www.calculator.net/area-calculator.html
    I tell it 5 yards length and 5 feet width, and compute......
    I'm glad that you were able to figure it out manually. It would've taken me a second to go from sq ft to sq yards

  5. #15
    Senior Member HoosierT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Fishers, IN
    Hammock
    DIY GE
    Insulation
    Down TQ/UQ
    Suspension
    DynaGlide UCRs
    Posts
    380
    I want to point out that the .75 membrane you have listed in the tarp section IS NOT a waterproof fabric. It's a downproof material for quilts, clothing, etc. Also, while the Mountain 7D can be used as a tarp material, it's really meant to be more of a waterproof/breathable material for down shells, bivys, etc. It has a relatively low hydrostatic head so misting is very likely in rainy conditions. As such, I would recommend removing that as a contender for a thru hike. To that end, why aren't you considering 1.1 Silpoly for weight and cost?

  6. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    South Texas
    Hammock
    11 foot gathered hexon1.7
    Tarp
    11 ft winter dutch
    Insulation
    TQ and UQ
    Suspension
    Spider Straps 1.5
    Posts
    591
    Are you absolutely positive about that Hoosier?

    Since I'm not the expert on the newest fabrics, I got the information straight from ripstopbytheroll. I wanted to look at all of the "light" fabrics that could be used for tarps. If you look at the decimals in parenthesis, the larger number is the best value based on weight and cost.

    Here is the information for Mountain 7D. "The Mountain Series is a hand selected collection of the highest performance fabrics/materials on earth - each one optimized for applications ranging from tarp/shelters, to quilts, hammocks, packs, and other high-end outdoor gear....igh water/wind resistance while also maintaining good breathability (see lab specs below). It's also calendered and fully downproof for use with natural goose and duck down insulation....Typical uses include quilt shells, jackets, tarps, blankets, rain mittens, beanies, or any application requiring a durable ultralight fabric with an excellent combination of wind/water resistance and moderate breathability."

    Now, are they incorrect in listing it under tarp material? I ask, because again I'm being honest about not knowing these fabrics. I'm just going off this one website.

    Let's take the time to look at these tarp fabric choices.
    0.51 Dyneema Composite Fiber weighs 4.25 ounces x 32 dollars = 160 dollars. (0.15)
    0.74 Mountain 7D weighs 6.16 ounces x 16 dollars = 80 dollars (0.20)
    0.75 Membrane 10 Ripstop weighs 6.25 ounces x 11 dollars = 55 dollars (0.29)
    1.10 Silnylon weighs 9.16 ounces x 6 dollars = 30 dollars. (0.36)

    Looking at my basic calculations, silnylon is the best value with a 0.36 ratio of weight to cost. I determine which is the best value by calculations. Then, I look at weight savings and determine which is the best value for a thru-hike. If we look at 0.75 membrane compared to 1.1 silnylon, we can see that it weighs nearly 3 ounces less, for only 25 dollars more. If I compare the 0.74 to the 1.1 silnylon, then we can see that it's still about 3 ounces less, for fifty dollars more. This is why, even though the Mountain series is listed as a tarp material on their website, that it's their Membrane series that is a better deal for a thru-hike.

    It's definitely not worth the cost of 25 dollars to shave off 0.09 ounces. That 25 bucks can go to some other real weight saving change (like changing out MSR groundhogs for Titanium Stakes. Four MSR groundhogs weigh about 60 grams, where 4 titanium stakes from Vargo weigh only 28 grams. At an upgrade cost of only 13 dollars, it's a 32 ounce savings which converts to 1.13 ounces.

  7. #17
    Senior Member HoosierT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Fishers, IN
    Hammock
    DIY GE
    Insulation
    Down TQ/UQ
    Suspension
    DynaGlide UCRs
    Posts
    380
    Quote Originally Posted by Trambo View Post
    Are you absolutely positive about that Hoosier?

    Since I'm not the expert on the newest fabrics, I got the information straight from ripstopbytheroll. I wanted to look at all of the "light" fabrics that could be used for tarps. If you look at the decimals in parenthesis, the larger number is the best value based on weight and cost.

    Here is the information for Mountain 7D. "The Mountain Series is a hand selected collection of the highest performance fabrics/materials on earth - each one optimized for applications ranging from tarp/shelters, to quilts, hammocks, packs, and other high-end outdoor gear....igh water/wind resistance while also maintaining good breathability (see lab specs below). It's also calendered and fully downproof for use with natural goose and duck down insulation....Typical uses include quilt shells, jackets, tarps, blankets, rain mittens, beanies, or any application requiring a durable ultralight fabric with an excellent combination of wind/water resistance and moderate breathability."

    Now, are they incorrect in listing it under tarp material? I ask, because again I'm being honest about not knowing these fabrics. I'm just going off this one website.

    Let's take the time to look at these tarp fabric choices.
    0.51 Dyneema Composite Fiber weighs 4.25 ounces x 32 dollars = 160 dollars. (0.15)
    0.74 Mountain 7D weighs 6.16 ounces x 16 dollars = 80 dollars (0.20) (Could be used but per the above and below, it will mist and sag. Maybe okay for a weekend, but I wouldn't want it for a thru hike)
    0.75 Membrane 10 Ripstop weighs 6.25 ounces x 11 dollars = 55 dollars (0.29) (Not waterproof/coated material, used for quilts and the like)
    1.10 Silnylon weighs 9.16 ounces x 6 dollars = 30 dollars. (0.36)

    Looking at my basic calculations, silnylon is the best value with a 0.36 ratio of weight to cost. I determine which is the best value by calculations. Then, I look at weight savings and determine which is the best value for a thru-hike. If we look at 0.75 membrane compared to 1.1 silnylon, we can see that it weighs nearly 3 ounces less, for only 25 dollars more. If I compare the 0.74 to the 1.1 silnylon, then we can see that it's still about 3 ounces less, for fifty dollars more. This is why, even though the Mountain series is listed as a tarp material on their website, that it's their Membrane series that is a better deal for a thru-hike.

    It's definitely not worth the cost of 25 dollars to shave off 0.09 ounces. That 25 bucks can go to some other real weight saving change (like changing out MSR groundhogs for Titanium Stakes. Four MSR groundhogs weigh about 60 grams, where 4 titanium stakes from Vargo weigh only 28 grams. At an upgrade cost of only 13 dollars, it's a 32 ounce savings which converts to 1.13 ounces.
    I am sure. I've both used it and am very well versed in the offering from RBTR. Below is their statement from the initial launch thread . Also as I stated above, you'll want to remove the .75 Membrane 10 from your list as it's not a waterproof fabric, it's for quilts and similar down gear.

    tarprobic7d.JPGtarprobic7d.JPG

    Also, most people prefer Silpoly these days due to the lack of stretch when wet. You'll notice that UGQ, Dutch, YMG, etc. have nearly all switched to polyester for that reason. Both 1.1 Silpoly and Silnylon have a "finished" weight of 1.24 osy (1.1 before coating, 1.24 after) and Silpoly is $5.95/yard so you should definitely look into it.

    https://ripstopbytheroll.com/collect...1-1-oz-silpoly
    Last edited by HoosierT; 01-14-2019 at 11:55.

  8. #18
    Senior Member HoosierT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Fishers, IN
    Hammock
    DIY GE
    Insulation
    Down TQ/UQ
    Suspension
    DynaGlide UCRs
    Posts
    380
    Also from the first post of the intro thread:


    This fabric would actually be even lighter than our ultralight Membrane 10 taffeta, but we wanted to add something extra special. For the 7D ROBIC, we're using a specially formulated backside coating to achieve much higher water resistance (> 1000 mm HH) and... here's the kicker... still maintain good breathability with an MVTR (this is the hydrostatic head equivalent for breathability) of > 7000 g/m2/24 hr.

    Combined with the durability of ROBIC and a downproof finish, you get a material that's excellent for ultralight applications like:

    - Quilt shells
    - Jackets
    - Rain mittens
    - Hammock socks

    I'm sure there are more that I'm not thinking of too. Anything where you desire a breathable fabric with water resistance approaching that of a tarp material . Lastly, to eliminate any confusion, the Mountain 7D was formerly known as Robic 7D. Same stuff.
    Last edited by HoosierT; 01-14-2019 at 11:42.

  9. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    South Texas
    Hammock
    11 foot gathered hexon1.7
    Tarp
    11 ft winter dutch
    Insulation
    TQ and UQ
    Suspension
    Spider Straps 1.5
    Posts
    591
    They answered that perfectly, didn't they? That stretch sounds problematic.
    Thank you, I'm definitely not a fabric expert, and I will consider that silpoly.

  10. #20
    Senior Member HoosierT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Fishers, IN
    Hammock
    DIY GE
    Insulation
    Down TQ/UQ
    Suspension
    DynaGlide UCRs
    Posts
    380
    Quote Originally Posted by Trambo View Post
    They answered that perfectly, didn't they? That stretch sounds problematic.
    Thank you, I'm definitely not a fabric expert, and I will consider that silpoly.
    No problem! And for the record I wasn't out to prove you wrong. I was just trying to make sure you didn't end up with a less-than-sound tarp for a thru hike. Which, btw, good luck! I'm super jealous and hope it pans out for you. If you ever have any questions on gear making, don't hesitate to PM me. It's my hobby and my passion.

  • + New Posts
  • Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

    Similar Threads

    1. My tarp! And process.
      By Vibes. in forum Do-It-Yourself (DIY)
      Replies: 1
      Last Post: 04-23-2015, 19:03
    2. First DIY Hammock In Process
      By Fluteman in forum Do-It-Yourself (DIY)
      Replies: 16
      Last Post: 01-19-2015, 15:01
    3. Calendering Process
      By trailryder42 in forum Dream Hammock
      Replies: 1
      Last Post: 08-28-2013, 11:28

    Tags for this Thread

    Bookmarks

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •