Any reason *not* to buy a dyneema tarp?

[kroot]

I've been slumming it with a basic Wal-Mart blue tarp for a few trips, just to be sure that hammocking is right for me. I feel like I'm pretty locked in now and am looking at all my options for tarps that don't weight two pounds and take up half my pack.

From what I can tell, dyneema tarps are superior to other alternatives in basically every category: they're lighter, more waterproof, easier to repair, don't stretch, and last forever. The only downside I can see is the cost, but this feels like a "buy once, cry once" type of situation to me; better to just suck it up and get the best right now instead of buying 3-4 tarps over a few years.

Are there any variables that I'm leaving out? If the price was equal, is there ever a reason not to go with dyneema?

As far as I can tell, there's only two vendors that sell dyneema tarps: Hammock Gear and Zpacks. From the photos on their websites, it looks like they make essentially the same tarp (it even costs the same). Hammock Gear has more options, but I'm only considering an 11ft ridgeline, so I think either tarp would work fine for me. Are there other vendors that I'm not aware of? Does anyone have experience with both of these tarps and if so, which do you prefer?

Thanks for all the help.

[cmoulder]

Mountain Laurel Designs

Durability is debatable because cuben is less puncture resistant if a branch falls on it than say 15D or 20D silnylon/silpoly. But I've had a couple of them bounce off my cuben tarps, so it's not like they're delicate china teacups.

Definitely not as small when packed, especially if using a snake skin... actually makes a smaller package if folded.

Dries out faster when wet. Some people don't like the translucency of cuben... it doesn't bother me at all. Well maybe on those nights with a full moon glaring.

I have both the HG Hex 11' and the Hex std with doors 12'. Love 'em both. I also have lots of Zpacks groundling gear and the quality is excellent.

If forced to choose only one of the HG tarps, it'd be the 12' with doors simply because it can handle nastier weather, which one must allow for on longer hikes.

[kroot]

Personally, I think the translucency will be a plus. I love being able to see the sky, especially at night. Up north I'm going to have to bring an eyeshade for most of the year anyways, so being woken up early isn't much of a concern.

Looks like MLD doesn't make a tarp with doors (which is really all I'm considering at this point), but do have a nice asym model if I decide I need to be lighter in the future. Given the intensity of Alaskan weather, I'm not really comfortable with anything that won't completely close me off from the wind/rain.

[sqidmark]

I'd suggest the CF Palace over the standard with doors as it has longer sides. It's about the same overall size as the Superfly. I have a standard with doors and no real complaints, but I would not hesitate trading up for the palace if money were no object.

Last time I used the CF there was a full moon and I was wishing I had a pair of blinders with me.

[cmoulder]

I'd offer that even the HG with doors won't completely close out the weather... it doesn't have the width to go all the way to the ground like the more 4th-season-specific 'winter palace' type tarps, or even the WB Superfly.

Photo: HG hex std 12' with doors
Camp_Dutch_03.jpg

[kitsapcowboy]

Mountain Laurel Designs

Durability is debatable because cuben is less puncture resistant if a branch falls on it than say 15D or 20D silnylon/silpoly. But I've had a couple of them bounce off my cuben tarps, so it's not like they're delicate china teacups.

Definitely not as small when packed, especially if using a snake skin... actually makes a smaller package if folded.

Dries out faster when wet. Some people don't like the translucency of cuben... it doesn't bother me at all. Well maybe on those nights with a full moon glaring.

Agree with all of this. Cuben Friber definitely does not last forever, and there are concerns over puncture and abrasion resistance depending upon how you use it. Packability is poor compared to similarly sized tarps made from conventional fabrics. In addition to moonlight, the Dyneema provides essentially no shade, which some may miss when summer camping during long hot afternoons when you're looking for a respite from a day's hike and waiting for the sun to go down. DCF is also loud during rainstorms compared to silpoly or silnylon -- a bit like sleeping in a snare drum IMHO. If you've been hanging under a blue poly Wal-Mart tarp then the transition to loud Cuben Fiber won't be so bad -- except for the fact that your CF tarp costs 30 to 50 times as much. Cuben Fiber remains trendy in addition to being a high-tech high-performance material, so if getting props from your fellow hikers around the campfire or winning "whose tarp weighs less?" arguments is meaningful to you, it has added value. My HG CF hex has many advantages, but it is a niche tarp for me for use mostly in the shoulder seasons when I'll be hiking more than I'll be camping. This reduces its exposure to extreme conditions that might damage it and minimizes the acoustic and translucency issues while helping me move fast and light. Getting your priorities straight makes all the difference in deciding whether Cuben is right for you. For some, it's the only way to go, but I would argue that CF is not the ultimate hiking solution for everyone out there.

[James Fowler]

I've been slumming it with a basic Wal-Mart blue tarp for a few trips, just to be sure that hammocking is right for me. I feel like I'm pretty locked in now and am looking at all my options for tarps that don't weight two pounds and take up half my pack.

From what I can tell, dyneema tarps are superior to other alternatives in basically every category: they're lighter, more waterproof, easier to repair, don't stretch, and last forever. The only downside I can see is the cost, but this feels like a "buy once, cry once" type of situation to me; better to just suck it up and get the best right now instead of buying 3-4 tarps over a few years.
Are there any variables that I'm leaving out? If the price was equal, is there ever a reason not to go with dyneema?

Disclaimer: I'm still figuring out tarps myself, and I'm interested in but have never tried a Dyneema/Cuben fiber tarp. AFAIK Dyneema and Cuben Fiber are the same thing (with Dyneema being the "newer" name), so when you see posts about Cuben Fiber tarps, they're relevant. (right? If I'm wrong about that then the list below might be mismatched a bit). The closest I've come to using a "real" hammock tarp is my Hennessey Hex (which for me, so far, is actually pretty decent for a solo hang, although a tag heavy). That said, there are a few other things you might add to your list, base on what I've gleaned from other posts:

• Aesthetics : with DutchWare's Print2Fabric and RipStopByTheRoll's OutdoorInk programs, you can get some really amazing looking tarps. I don't think that's offered for Dyneema yet? The only options I've seen are the raw white-ish solid, darker solid colors, and camo. Rumor has it that may change someday, but for now it looks like the "pretty" tarps are silnylon/poly/xenon...
• Variety : related to cost, and doesn't technically matter "if the price was equal", but you may end up wanting different tarps for different requirements (seasons / anticipated weather conditions / solo vs tandem / group vs back-country / car camping vs backpacking...). If so, you can't just buy once. Also, if you haven't nailed down exactly what configuration works best for you for a given requirement, the cost of experimenting and changing your mind can go up substantially.
• Packing size : I think I've read that Dyneema doesn't pack as tight as silnylon/poly? So while it's lighter, it can take up more volume in your pack? (not sure about that though)
• Opacity / light : It appears that Dyneema - especially the lighter or uncolored versions - lets a lot more light through than other tarp fabrics. This can mean less privacy and more exposure to ambient light. Less shade during the day, and if you like it dark when you sleep, you might be surprised how noticeable a full moon overhead can be when it's nice out and you try going tarpless... I think other's have mentioned that a Dyneema tarp help doesn't help much blocking a full moon.
• Noise : Others have mentioned that things like rainfall on a Dyneema tarp are "louder" than other fabrics - kinda like rain on a tin roof. Personally, that sounds like a bonus to me, but YMMV, HYOH.
• DIY : If you're into DIY, I've seen very little on how to make your own Dyneema tarps. Haven't looked, and it's probably out there, but not as readily available as, say kitsapcowboy's ongoing saga chronicling the innovate use and abuse of Xenon Sil...

As far as I can tell, there's only two vendors that sell dyneema tarps: Hammock Gear and Zpacks. From the photos on their websites, it looks like they make essentially the same tarp (it even costs the same). Hammock Gear has more options, but I'm only considering an 11ft ridgeline, so I think either tarp would work fine for me. Are there other vendors that I'm not aware of?

I've seen indications that DutchWare has / is working on offering more options for DIY dyneema materials (fabric, tape, etc.). But I don't know if they have any plans to start making and selling dyneema tarps.

Good luck with your search!

[James Fowler]

OK, still getting a feel for things around here, but I've gotta say this is really an amazing forum. I've been occasionally involved in other "online communities", but I don't think I've seen any that match both the breadth of experience and the willingness to freely share it found here. The only downside for me is that there's less opportunity for providing helpful answers, because by the time I finish writing something up it's already been preempted by others with far more experience than me .

Such a heavy burden to bear. If only I had somewhere comfortable to put my feet up and rest for a while...

[James Fowler]

For some, it's the only way to go, but I would argue that CF is not the ultimate hiking solution for everyone out there.

LOL, I suspect that many, if not most of the experienced members around here - even the die-hard CF enthusiasts - would not only agree with you but also "would argue that ADD ANYTHING YOU WANT HERE is not the ultimate hiking solution for everyone out there" *. Another amazing thing about this forum - the "one true way" demagogues seem refreshingly absent. Even those convinced that they've found the perfect solution - for them - often clarify that it's not necessarily the best for everyone. And instead of futile debates about "what's the best", people post useful information about tradeoffs, pros and cons, and encourage people to find what's best for them. Hike your own hike. Great stuff.

---

* except, perhaps, "staying off the ground if at all possible" ...

[rweb82]

If you can be patient, Wilderness Logics is coming out with an 11' polyblend tarp that they say will weigh less than 10oz. That puts it dang-near in DCF territory. And my guess is it will be less expensive than DCF. They don't mention the width yet, or when it will be released.