WI >7th Annual WI Frozen Butt Hang > Waupaca > Jan 12-14, 2018 > Trip Report

**Karla "with a k"** · 01-14-2018, 17:36

Please post all of your stories, pictures, comments and suggestions here.

Here the link to the original post: https://www.hammockforums.net/forum/...Jan-12-14-2018

**Watertooner** · 01-14-2018, 22:03

After a fantastic hot shower, unpacking gear, throwing clothes into the washer, and a supper of the last of the pub burgers, it's time for a report:

It was great to meet NickoftheWoods who organized the WI FBH 2018 and a bunch of other interesting people I met for the first time to go along with the bunch of people I've hung with over this past year. A year ago at this time, I started hanging inside at home in search of a good night's sleep. A year later, I set a PR of -15º outdoors at the FBH. The folks at HF and those I've met at WI hangs have been a big help in figuring things out and getting out to enjoy WI's beauty. I stayed warm during the day and at night while having a great time.

The chute on Friday afternoon...

...and on Friday night

We had 40 acres of private woodland near the Ice Age Trail to choose from for site selection. I ended up about a 100 yds from the chute (and not downwind - getting smarter as I hang more often). The chute was a great place for palaver, cooking, and staying warm during the day.

I used my Packa to lay things out while setting up. You can see my step-over-step snow tracks to find the right trees:

New Warbonnet BB XLC version 2:

Superfly tarp set low to keep cold air out. I used branches to anchor tarp guy lines. There was very little wind so the tarp stayed in place.

Second time out with a fully-loaded Molly Mack Pack including a front panel for this weekend

Tried out the Packa rain gear for the first time as well. There was no chance of rain, but it was a good time to practice deploying it.

There were several Smokehouse hot tents at the hang this year. Very tempting as a future purchase when the owners talked about sitting in their skivvies at 75º or warmer while it was well below 0º outside. No pics of said skivvies, but that's a good thing...my eyes watered enough this weekend.

The site - just a few miles out of Waupaca - was fantastic and very primitive. Many thanks to the property owner for allowing us to enjoy the land and the views. No water or "facilities" were included so I was able to do my first imitation of a bear in the woods since 1978. Since it was so freaking cold, it was easy to come back and pack the frozen tundra turds in LNT fashion to a garbage can in nearby Wautoma. That may be a bit TMI, but, hey, that's how people can learn about the challenges and opportunities of a great deep winter hang!

**Karla "with a k"** · 01-14-2018, 23:02

My first FBH and first time at this base camp of Nick "of the Woods". Since I was just at Hartman Creek SP for BACONFEST last year and this property is right next door, I felt pretty confident of the directions. Nick's additional instructions were helpful and I didn't hear of anyone having problems locating the property.

The drive into the property was beautiful. My only wish is that there was MORE SNOW!

I see cars! This must be the place!

I was thankful Nick said the trail was the end of the building because I would have wandered around for a bit to find it.

Since I arrived on Saturday, I walked around to scope out a good spot and see everyone's set up. (Hey, let me know if this is your set up and I'll write your name by your pic!)

Aaah, the infamous parachute! I had seen it only in pictures. Pretty fantastic up close too!

Harley & Karla "with a k". Just a few icicles from his moustache and beard.

Swung (a.k.a.) Axe & Tumbleweed's hot tents. Goobie's and Gopher's hammocks.

My pop froze and started oozing out of the top and when it dribbled down into the cup holder, it instantly froze. #reallycold

Kyle's tent set up. Yup, we allow tent campers to attend. (Some allow it just to convert them to hammocks though. hee hee)

Here are Nick "of the woods" set up and Melicia's (She also was awarded the Bad A$$ Woman Award for sleeping in her hammock all night in the cold and it's only her 2nd time hammock camping. (Award to come)

Swung (AXE) is throwing logs off his truck and Canoeski would throw them in a sled to be pulled up the hill.

Who is claiming this?

Swung (a.k.a. AXE) was SUPER BAD A$$ flinging the logs like they were toothpicks. (New profile picture?)

Whose gear is this at the top of the hill?

I was looking darn cute on the trail with the snow. #totalbrag #notsohumble

Was this Chris's set up?

My set up looks so sad and droopy. Last time for my Tato tarp connectors. Will try out my new line locks next time.

Check out Tumbleweed hauling the log up the hill on his shoulder. He must be eating his spinach!

Nick of the Woods' hot tent - used for community space. We did have one person sleep in it on Saturday night. (And yes, it was a tent camper)

This stew was the best stew I've ever had. Nick of the Woods, you can cook for me anytime. Plus, I think Saturday Stew night needs to become a tradition!

Parachute during the day with the smoke billowing out from everywhere!

Yes, the red bra was there!

Nick "of the Woods, Tumbleweed, and Swung (a.k.a AXE)

Tumbleweed's new toboggan that Swung (a.k.a AXE) made. (I think he still has one to sell, if you are interested!)

Andy "The German", Canoeski, Kyle "The Keynote" and Watertooner.

* We need to remember to get a group picture next time.
* Who wants to give a post about the high/lows and weather so it's recorded?

**Karla "with a k"** · 01-15-2018, 21:48

A brief video tour of basecamp.

**Watertooner** · 01-16-2018, 00:22

With the MLK holiday, I used the time off to rest up after a fun, but tiring WI FBH. Between mini-naps, I read up and watched a bunch of videos from previous frozen hangs - including some post-hang reflections from 2011 by a guy with the name of fourdog. I've learned some things in the past year, but by no means have I learned enough so I decided to borrow some of fourdog reflections and use them to think about our hang this weekend.

What worked and worked well?

-Traditional clothing! Wool, windproof cotton outer layer, mukluks.
Allowed moisture to escape, outer layers protected the wool when harvesting wood and when standing around the fire.
-High tech clothing:
Breathable laminates don't "breath well" in those temps.
Are fragile to the work demands around camp and are easily damaged by heat and fire.
Down sweaters make a poor work layer, sweat builds up in the down and it no longer works. As an over parka, it's great but not a work layer.

Wool outer layers were very evident at the WI FBH. I made a mental note to start visiting thrift stores or get serious with saving some $ for wool. Fourdogs' advice is to protect the wool with yet another outer layer (I'm guessing flannel or cotton/canvass) with doing camp work or hanging by the fire and its smoke and embers. I don't own wool or down clothing - yet. Instead, I brought my Striker Ice Hardwater bibs and jacket - designed for standing around in seriously cold temps. I wasn't cold at all during the two days, but I have to wonder about the wear and tear on an ice fishing suit when doing camp chores or standing under a creosote stained parachute. Mukluks were common in our group as well. I wore my heavy Baffin Titan ice fishing boots (see a pattern here?) and had warm feet. Again, these were made for standing around, not walking up and down hills so my legs were a bit fatigued after two days.
Gloves: I wore wool half-finger gloves the entire time even while sleeping. My $hopping list now has gloves for working around a campfire or humping/hauling firewood.

-Sleds and pulks
My ice fishing sled worked okay, but since there was an easy trail and a mere two inches of snow, my sled system wasn't performance stressed. If the snow was deeper or if the terrain was rougher, I can see the value of having a true pulk with a pole set to control things better. More $ to save for future fun.

Sleep systems - and sleep cothing:
-A warm sleep system that allowed the user to sleep through the night without outside help (hot water bottles, eating and getting up have to adjust the sleep system.)
Winter camping is hard work, you burning up to 6,500 cal per day. You need a good night's sleep undisturbed to be fit for the next day.
-Claustrophopic Sleep system
Has to be managed to sleep well in the colder temps the feeling of being bundled can not be avoided.
-Frost and sleep systems
Has to be managed, can't be avoided. All bedding should be aired out every day and allowed to dry by process of sublimation (changing from solid to gas with no liquid stage)
If not your sleep system will be compromised within two to three days and fail. Dark colors are best to absorb the sun light.
-Frost build up around breathing hole of peapod system.
Build up frost compromises insulation. Some sort of breathing tube or snorkeled hood necessary to reduce build up.
-Down sleeping systems with OVER stuffed down.
Your high fill (900fp) loses its loft quickly when frost forms in the clusters and will fail, but over stuffing helps to prevent that.
-Combine clothing with sleep system.
-Peapod sleep systems and sealed under quilts (velcroed to hammock).
-Down foot and lower leg bag.
Best cure for cold feet, take a light summer down bag cinch the head end and push it down into the foot end place over feet and lower legs. It fills the void and takes care of cold feet like mittens on your hands.
-Jumbo foam reflective windshield guards. When placed directly under you in the hammock they make a great insulator, vapor barrier to your under insulator layer.
I know it works and works well because in those low temps the learner feels the difference right away.
-Hammock socks or over covers (added warmth and allow the moisture to pass through and not frost into insulation).

A number of our hangers had Warbonnet systems. We almost named the hill behind the chute Warbonnet Hill to "compete" with all the Smokehouse hot tent dudes across the trail in Smokehouse Lane. A lot of campfire talk deals with primary/secondary suspensions, adjustments, special combinations of favorite and new vendors, preferred materials and colors, etc. I tend to do a lot of interested listening to all of this, but don't have a whole lot to add to the discussions because I'm 98% into a Warbonnet system from Superfly tarp to a Blackbird XLC DL with vented winter topcover to two Wooki UQs (0º + 20º, stacked) to a 0º Mamba TQ. The final 2% is a 2QZQ UQP. The whole system is simple and it simply works - because all the design features and principles work closely together with no need for middle of the night adjustments. The Wooki UQs seal off most drafts and the Mamba TQ seals off the rest. I had no issues with frost or sweat below me. I did rig up a frost bib to manage my exhaled condensation and protect the insulation qualities of the TQ. By using the vented winter topcover, I gained a few more degrees of warmth while having to manage frost build-up on the topcover and on the bib. Every move when exiting the rig is choreographed to try to avoid disturbing the frost. The tradeoff is acceptable. Because the quilt systems are so efficient, I am able to wear just a single base layer of comfy ice fishing pants/shirt with wool socks and full ice fishing hood over my head and wool gloves - that's it. No feelings of being compressed by multiple layers of clothing or claustrophobia - just easy, warm, and roomy (much easier to get undressed and dressed as well with fewer articles needed). The tarp blocked all wind and did not have any condensation/frost. Goobie put me on to the strategy of managing all drafts and letting the down quilts do their jobs by using the heat from your body - easily transmitted through a single, light layer of clean, dry clothing reserved for use at night - to stay toasty all night. The Warbonnet system complements that strategy to a tee.

Food and eating/drinking for deep winter:
-Large high fat communal meal 1-2 hours before going to bed. By doing that everyone had fuel in the belly to sleep through the night and stay warm.
-Large pot for melting snow over fire, allowed folks a constant supply of warm water to drink and stay hydrated.

NickoftheWoods and other experienced hangers really took care of the group when dealing with caloric intake and hydration throughout the day and especially for the communal evening meal. The site had a 12-14 foot tall tripod with a hefty cross member across two legs from which to hang a couple large pots for heating water from morning through night. The long fire was easily 7-8 feet long so there was enough room for cooking and getting warm. The porkchops and pot roast on Sat night were just the ticket. I didn't bring any water or means with which to light a fire, but relied on "someone else" to take care of those essentials. That means I had trust in others, but if they somehow needed to trust me for those items, I would have been empty-handed. So my list for "next time" includes water, water management, and the tools for fire starting - just in case. I did bring food to share, but that doesn't cover all the bases. I also need to construct some cozies for my cups and such. I did squirrel away a bag of Snickers in the "fun" size to have a fuel snack when climbing into the hammock at midnight and for a snack between 3-5 a.m. to deal with a growling stomach. I was amazed how much better I felt and how much warmer I was for doing that. Even at rest in a warm rig, your body is burning a lot of calories to stay at a comfortable equilibrium.

Weak links and needs improvement:
-Clothing management
-Fire skills !!!
If you can not build a warming drying fire quickly in an emergency you are putting yourself and whoever is with you in danger. All the old hands I know have all experienced the importance of it. It's not a matter if you will need it, it's a matter of when if you go out on a regular basis.
-Gear does not make up for skills.
-Under quilts and over quilts...if a person has to wake up and adjust the sleep system to sleep sound that's a weak link and has to be improved. They just don't seal as well as a unit unless velcroed to hammock.
No tent winter campers use a quilt system in the deep cold for that reason.
-Water bottles...
They all freeze, if you have to use them get metal ones and wide neck.
If you need to sleep with one to stay warm you do not have a good enough sleep system for the conditions you may find.
At -15*F if that water leaks in to your sleep system, it's not uncomfortable...it's dangerous.
Footwear...
-Rubber foot box boots (sorrel type). Moisture builds up in the insulation and by the end of the day you start to have cold feet and into the second day things get worse. Liners
are hard to dry out because of the thick felt.
-Down booties...
Great for slippers around the house. Down keeps you warm by loft but does not work well when compressed in foot box of hammock or outer foot wear.
-Whoopie slings...
I love whoopie slings but they don't work as well in the colder temps. To much fiddle factor with exposed fingers. I like climbing daisy chains in the lower temps can adjust with mitten hands.

I currently use Whoopies on my hammock, but fourdogs makes a great case for switching to a simpler, cold-proof method. Daisy chain straps are now on my li$t.

Those are things I found work and didn't work well.The fun thing in the deep cold things work or don't work . You don't have to wait long to find out. This how I do it, your welcome to do it any way you like.
So too I experienced some things that worked well and some that didn't at what I would rate as a relatively straight-forward Frozen Butt event. Yes, it got down to -15º, but we didn't have to deal with much wind or any precipitation at all. The snow cover was just 2 inches so we had easy maneuvering. Perhaps some others will add some observations to help us "do it any way you like" as fourdog says.

**Tumbleweed** · 01-16-2018, 08:57

Lots of excellent advice here. Group hangs bring out the best ideas. Winter camping consists of solving little problems so that they do not become bigger / life-risking events. Even cold fingers and/or toes suggest changing something before damaging tissues.

Yes, a lot of calories needed, thus we are refueling regularly, including the mid-night potty breaks...