Glorified Hammock Sock?

**psyculman** · 08-25-2017, 14:52

In dry conditions this product would be great. But I will add to what others have noted. A tarp is most important because of:
1. Wet weather emergency set up. Tarp deployment imperative, and fast!
2. Condensation: adequate air flow, and clearance from breath, especially with below freezing temperatures
3. Ease of night time exit and entry w/o compromising percipition leakage.
4. Subfreezing temperatures; you are going to need a lot more insulation, especially for the dreaded CBS
5. Windy weather wind deflection.
6. Tarp covered area to dress and cook in wet and snowy conditions.
This is however based on latitudes of 41 degrees north and more. In my experience

**fallkniven** · 08-25-2017, 18:09

So this is what I'm getting from this. This product is made for the inexperienced, but then why change things so much instead of simplifying what already works?
I don't care what you say, condensation will absolutely be an issue since you can't change physics, so it's really only for those in dry climates. It'll never work here on the humid coastline.
When it rains, setting up will suck, and you have no protection for gear or cooking dinner or taking a leak.
Your saying if it rains, also bring a tarp. Then why would I bring both and not just the tarp? If it's for those, just in case moments, why be so fully enclosed if you don't have to? Why not just bring the tarp and only set up if needed?
I like innovation, but there are key issues that are cause for concern, like how do you keep the rain from wicking into the hammock from the suspension? And waterproof/breathable air vents? I thought everyone knew waterproof/breathable was anything but reliable.
I think this will appeal to gear junkies that don't know any better, more than the mass of hammockers.

**Hiker Boy** · 08-25-2017, 18:30

I think sometimes we get comfortable with the status quo and look at innovation with a certain amount of (often earned) skepticism. I know that before I discovered hammocks, I was using a tarp over ground while my expensive tents languished in the gear closet....so yeah, I'm kinda a tarp guy. However, I am also a gearhead and I am encouraged that people are always trying to come up with new ideas and modifications to old systems. So kudos to you Caleb and best of luck with your venture.

PS. I want to see a video of your system in the rain.

**Beemermcr** · 08-25-2017, 22:01

Well, I went in on the Kickstarter and am willing to give up $100 to see if this works for MY needs. I surely understand and appreciate the concerns discussed - and most will likely be an issue. But, I started with a Hennessy Safari a long time ago and gave up due to CBS. Tom Hennessy's early experimentation did not work for me, and a large investment in a Big Agnes did not either.

Fast Forward to a year ago, and, for a lark, I tried again on a motorcycle rally - again, CBS ruled, but I decided to search and found this site, and the wondrous knowledge here and with our cottage vendors!! I now have a marvelous collection of UQs/TQs/UQPs/Tarps to go with my collection of hammocks!! I am a car/bike hanger and a home hanger. Way to old/fat to worry about ounces, much less grams!

I have collected components trying to achieve a workable, for me, system. I am very close, and budget really is the limitation to achieving what will work for me. The SHEL guys are coming at it from a system standpoint, including components that they think will work for their target market. Many of the folks here are likely not that market. I have watched this since I saw a PR piece on local TV site - what I see are some very earnest people trying to innovate in a rising hammock market - without pedigree or a lot of bona vides. But seeing the product evolve over time to the one on Kickstarter convinced me that they respond to feedback and are still trying to make the best product they can, for their market. I suspect the SHEL I finally receive will be better than the one I decided to back on Kickstarter.

**Chesapeake** · 08-25-2017, 23:12

I agree, it might not be the best option for certain situations and in some cases better for casual/ inexperienced hangers or car camping. The only way to find out for sure though is to try one out. Im interested in seeing how the final production version does that's why I asked to review it and post my results here and my YouTube channel. Time and hands on experience with it is the ultimate test of it though. I'd like to compare my review to yours once we get them , should be interesting I think...

**fallkniven** · 08-26-2017, 09:42

I've got another question, how do you get in and out of it? I don't see a side zipper entry, it looks like you have to loosen the ridgeline to slide the thing away everytime. So, if you roll into camp and it's raining. You set it up. Now how do you get in and out while it's raining, without getting inside your hammock wet? Plus, I'm not seeing anything that's stopping the rain from wicking down the suspension into your hammock.
Also, if the whole thing is made from waterproof material, what's stopping the condensation and general body moisture from setting into your down without escape? Is the inside fabric waterproof too? Still doesn't sound good for anything more than a couple nights.

**Carrico** · 08-26-2017, 10:41

I really don't understand what all the hating on hammock socks is all about, I would imagine most people that have such negative viewpoints have never even used one. I've been using a Dutch winter sock for two and a half years now and it took all of two trips before it became a permanent staple in my gear list. I do most of my camping on the west North Coast of California and experienced a lot of wind driven rain and heavy wet fog, the hammock sock has greatly improved my camping experience and really helps keep all my gear dry and the wind out. It's gotten to the point where Its taken on every outing and in the summertime use it in lieu of a tarp. The only two times I've ever experienced condensation problems is when it was just above freezing and the dew point was very low and I sealed it up to help keep warm, without adequate venting it did cause some condensation but not nearly as bad as single wall tents that I've used in the past. If I had not already invested money in the setup I have I would certainly considering getting one of these. I would strongly urge you to put a zipper modification on the side for easier entry and exit, this was my main complaint of the Dutch winter sock before I added one, having one makes it so much easier to get in and out of. And in heavy winter storms or severe summer thunderstorms, I take my Superfly as well and use both. if you're still looking for people to test them, I would be perfectly happy to do that for you;<) good luck with your venture.

**fallkniven** · 08-26-2017, 11:09

Originally Posted by Carrico

I really don't understand what all the hating on hammock socks is all about, I would imagine most people that have such negative viewpoints have never even used one. I've been using a Dutch winter sock for two and a half years now and it took all of two trips before it became a permanent staple in my gear list. I do most of my camping on the west North Coast of California and experienced a lot of wind driven rain and heavy wet fog, the hammock sock has greatly improved my camping experience and really helps keep all my gear dry and the wind out. It's gotten to the point where Its taken on every outing and in the summertime use it in lieu of a tarp. The only two times I've ever experienced condensation problems is when it was just above freezing and the dew point was very low and I sealed it up to help keep warm, without adequate venting it did cause some condensation but not nearly as bad as single wall tents that I've used in the past. If I had not already invested money in the setup I have I would certainly considering getting one of these. I would strongly urge you to put a zipper modification on the side for easier entry and exit, this was my main complaint of the Dutch winter sock before I added one, having one makes it so much easier to get in and out of. And in heavy winter storms or severe summer thunderstorms, I take my Superfly as well and use both. if you're still looking for people to test them, I would be perfectly happy to do that for you;<) good luck with your venture.

Those are two different things. Your talking about a non-waterproof sock to help in the cold winter temps. This is supposed to replace your tarp,underquilt, and apparently your top quilt too, in one sock shaped thing. It just doesn't look practical in anyway as a replacement for your tarp in the rain. Lots of points being asked, but none really answered...

**Carrico** · 08-26-2017, 11:22

Even the Aragon 90 Dutch winter hammock sock with big mesh vent on top keeps me dry in moderate fog drizzle. I would imagine a waterproof sock with protected vents would keep you dry in a moderate rain. However and quite obviously, in a downpour getting in and out would be an issue as to Would cooking and keeping your gear dry, however with the addition of a small tarp it would quite mitigate the problem. The rep from the company has said as much. Even if it did not work in heavy rain as a stand-alone shelter the addition of insulation, if it indeed works as advertised in my opinion is a cool idea. And at only 20 oz if it is indeed effective down to 30 degrees that would be quite a weight saving over my current setup.