Quilt questions: outer material and length + other misc

**kitsapcowboy** · 08-08-2017, 11:08

Originally Posted by nquinn

I'm just getting started with all of this so tormenting myself on getting the right gear from the start. Interesting that you don't like the feel of M10. The bandit quilts only offer HD1.0 as an exterior fabric. You're stuck with M10 on the interior, though I previously thought this was a good thing because it's so light.

How tough is the Ion fabric? Good enough for an exterior? I see it's 1oz/yd so I imagine it's ok, but saw no mention of rip-stop.

The MEMBRANE10 is fine, and it's a high-quality ultralight fabric, but the finish doesn't feel as soft to me as either of the others; I don't mind MEMBRANE inside a 20F deep winter quilt because, honestly, I am going to be wearing a full-coverage sleeping layer any night that I spend in it.

Ion is a taffeta (no ripstop grid), which is part of why it feels so soft, but it is still pretty tough stuff and has a nice tight weave; I have been kicking around in my LLG 40F Saver Series Serrano for a month and a half now, and its Ion shells *inside and out) still look brand new, holding up perfectly so far. Ultimately, at the level of vendor quality where you are shopping, you're not going to go horribly wrong. I wouldn't sweat it.

**Peppy** · 08-11-2017, 06:06

I have 3 Bandits, 2-20 degree one 40. I dont think fabric will matter unless your extremely rough on your quilt, but I like M10 on the inside and H.D. 1.0 on the outside. One 20 of mine is no taper with 2 ounce overstuff and a snap footbox. The other is a 20 with no overstuff and a sewn footbox. I like them both, but use one as a blanket at the foot of my bed turned sideways so I wanted to lay it flat. I'm 5'9" as well (okay, maybe 5'8-1/2") and I can use a 72" but prefer the 78".

**Peppy** · 08-11-2017, 06:08

Originally Posted by Foxpoop

I haven't owned either, so I am probably not the best to answer that. I was very interested in the design of the Bandit, but I have a size 13 shoe. A friend of mine with the same size feet said that the footbox on the Bandit felt cramped for him. Having said that, if I really wanted a Bandit, Is m sure that Paul and Missy would make sure the footbox was sized appropriately for me. The wait time on the Serrano could be an issue? Design looks good and LL reputation is great (but so is UGQ).
That probably didn't help you st all. Sorry.

One of my Bamdits is a no taper and the footbox is HUGE!

**nquinn** · 08-11-2017, 08:56

Originally Posted by Peppy

I have 3 Bandits, 2-20 degree one 40. I dont think fabric will matter unless your extremely rough on your quilt, but I like M10 on the inside and H.D. 1.0 on the outside. One 20 of mine is no taper with 2 ounce overstuff and a snap footbox. The other is a 20 with no overstuff and a sewn footbox. I like them both, but use one as a blanket at the foot of my bed turned sideways so I wanted to lay it flat. I'm 5'9" as well (okay, maybe 5'8-1/2") and I can use a 72" but prefer the 78".

Thanks for the data point. I'll definitely go with the longer quilt. Still not sure if I should try to save the 1.35oz and go with M10 on as the outer fabric. Here's what ripstopbytheroll replied to me in an email:

"Thanks for reaching out to us. The .66 MEMBRANE is a taffeta, not a ripstop. It makes a superb outer layer for ultralight quilts. If you're not counting grams, you may find the .9 MEMBRANE15 more to your liking. It is a little more durable, at the trade off of increased weight."

So, they don't seem too concerned about using it as an outer layer.

**HoosierT** · 08-11-2017, 09:06

IMO, a tougher shell in a hammock is really not needed. For someone on the ground who might cowboy camp, that's another story. I have used M10 on all my quilts ( I have made a few top quilts and two UQs) and have NEVER had an issue. Now, the other caveat is if you want to use it when you're not sleeping. Some people might wrap up in their quilt while sitting around camp. I have never been inclined to do this so the lighter material is a no-brainer. So: 1) Will you ever cowboy camp on the ground with it? 2) do you want to "wear" it around camp? If you answer no to both of those, I would highly recommend the M10 inside and out. In addition to weight savings, there is size savings as well in terms of compressibility. FWIW, I think M10 feels amazing and is very soft. My wife was amazed when I finished her first quilt using M10 and she even uses it around the house during the winter.

Secondly, I'm the exact same height as you. When I switched to Hammocks I already owned a 78" EE Enigma TQ. It was WAY too much quilt in my face in the hammock. Worked great on the ground though. However, I knew that I was sold on hammocks and would not go back to ground so I sold it and ordered a 72". It is perfection in a hammock. Go with a 72" and don't look back. Trust me...And finally, for a 20* I think a sewn footbox is the way to go. My summer quilt uses a zipper and drawcord footbox and the zipper drives me nuts under my feet. It's worth it for summer as I can open it up but it has to be over 60*F for me to care to have an open quilt. Since I know I'll NEVER use my 20* quilt in temps that warm, the sewn footbox was, without a doubt, the best choice. Hope this helps and good luck!

**nquinn** · 08-11-2017, 09:13

Originally Posted by Peppy

I have 3 Bandits, 2-20 degree one 40. I dont think fabric will matter unless your extremely rough on your quilt, but I like M10 on the inside and H.D. 1.0 on the outside. One 20 of mine is no taper with 2 ounce overstuff and a snap footbox. The other is a 20 with no overstuff and a sewn footbox. I like them both, but use one as a blanket at the foot of my bed turned sideways so I wanted to lay it flat. I'm 5'9" as well (okay, maybe 5'8-1/2") and I can use a 72" but prefer the 78".

Thanks for the data point. I'll definitely go with the longer quilt. Still not sure if I should try to save the 1.35oz and go with M10 on as the outer fabric. Here's what ripstopbytheroll replied to me in an email:

"Thanks for reaching out to us. The .66 MEMBRANE is a taffeta, not a ripstop. It makes a superb outer layer for ultralight quilts. If you're not counting grams, you may find the .9 MEMBRANE15 more to your liking. It is a little more durable, at the trade off of increased weight."

So, they don't seem too concerned about using it as an outer layer.

**nquinn** · 08-11-2017, 09:16

Originally Posted by HoosierT

IMO, a tougher shell in a hammock is really not needed. For someone on the ground who might cowboy camp, that's another story. I have used M10 on all my quilts ( I have made a few top quilts and two UQs) and have NEVER had an issue. Now, the other caveat is if you want to use it when you're not sleeping. Some people might wrap up in their quilt while sitting around camp. I have never been inclined to do this so the lighter material is a no-brainer. So: 1) Will you ever cowboy camp on the ground with it? 2) do you want to "wear" it around camp? If you answer no to both of those, I would highly recommend the M10 inside and out. In addition to weight savings, there is size savings as well in terms of compressibility. FWIW, I think M10 feels amazing and is very soft. My wife was amazed when I finished her first quilt using M10 and she even uses it around the house during the winter.

Secondly, I'm the exact same height as you. When I switched to Hammocks I already owned a 78" EE Enigma TQ. It was WAY too much quilt in my face in the hammock. Worked great on the ground though. However, I knew that I was sold on hammocks and would not go back to ground so I sold it and ordered a 72". It is perfection in a hammock. Go with a 72" and don't look back. Trust me...And finally, for a 20* I think a sewn footbox is the way to go. My summer quilt uses a zipper and drawcord footbox and the zipper drives me nuts under my feet. It's worth it for summer as I can open it up but it has to be over 60*F for me to care to have an open quilt. Since I know I'll NEVER use my 20* quilt in temps that warm, the sewn footbox was, without a doubt, the best choice. Hope this helps and good luck!

Hmm, so I should have specified that I am looking mostly at top quilts and will be sleeping on a pad on the ground to start. (I found this forum recently when researching quilts and plan to investigate hammocks, but am not sold on them yet). I think a smaller quilt makes a lot of sense in a hammock, but on the ground I feel like I'd want a bit more size since I'm used to sleeping bags.

I wonder if there's anywhere I can figure out just how much strength difference there is between M10 and HD1.0

**HoosierT** · 08-11-2017, 09:23

Originally Posted by nquinn

Hmm, so I should have specified that I am looking mostly at top quilts and will be sleeping on a pad on the ground to start. (I found this forum recently when researching quilts and plan to investigate hammocks, but am not sold on them yet). I think a smaller quilt makes a lot of sense in a hammock, but on the ground I feel like I'd want a bit more size since I'm used to sleeping bags.

I wonder if there's anywhere I can figure out just how much strength difference there is between M10 and HD1.0

When you say on the ground, will you be in an enclosed shelter (tent, bivy, etc. ) or will you be cowboy camping on a ground sheet and nothing else. Obviously with the ladder, ground debris are the concern. Otherwise, an M10 quilt is just fine in an enclosed shelter and is exactly what I used when I was still sleeping on the ground. I will emphasize that unless the quilt will be exposed to said debris, it is much stronger than you think. I know if you haven't handled it you probably think you're getting something REALLY fragile for the weight savings but M10 really isn't as fragile as you probably think it is. Keep if off the ground and away from sticks, bark, etc. and trust me it's plenty durable.

**nquinn** · 08-11-2017, 10:53

Originally Posted by HoosierT

When you say on the ground, will you be in an enclosed shelter (tent, bivy, etc. ) or will you be cowboy camping on a ground sheet and nothing else. Obviously with the ladder, ground debris are the concern. Otherwise, an M10 quilt is just fine in an enclosed shelter and is exactly what I used when I was still sleeping on the ground. I will emphasize that unless the quilt will be exposed to said debris, it is much stronger than you think. I know if you haven't handled it you probably think you're getting something REALLY fragile for the weight savings but M10 really isn't as fragile as you probably think it is. Keep if off the ground and away from sticks, bark, etc. and trust me it's plenty durable.

I'd definitely have a floor or tarp underneath me. Thanks for this input - seems safe enough to go with the lighter weight savings. I saw a Robic 7D riptop fabric on ripstopbytheroll that's .74oz/g that seems like the perfect outer fabric, but doesn't seem to be used by most quiltmakers yet.

**HoosierT** · 08-11-2017, 12:18

It's not used much on top quilts because it has a Urethane coating that makes it water proof. It's fairly breathable for what it is, but most would agree that it's not breathable enough for a top quilt. On the other hand, it does make for a great outer shell for an underquilt on a hammock. The huge number of quilts sold with ~.6 oz materials should go to show that it's is perfectly capable for the job and you'll also note that you will find virtually no complaints about real word durability issues.