Regular vs. Economy TQ's & Their Differences

[souperjen24]

I've been hammock-camping for over a year now, still using my 35* sleeping bag. I can't go through another Fall or Spring with this thing - it just doesn't keep me warm - so I'm looking to pull the trigger on a proper TQ. Of course, I've done tons of research and have considered all of the cottage vendors who are mentioned here on HF. I've been looking seriously at Loco Libre, Hammock Gear, and UGQ's lines and options. All of these companies also offer an economy/value line, which is great but also adds more options into the mix, making things a bit more difficult I have a spreadsheet going which lists all possible information among a variety of companies and their model options. This helps me be able to visually see everything as I'm comparing.

My question is specifically related to the differences of these companies in their regular line vs. their economy line. I can see that they are using less fill power (800 vs. 900 or 850), and also different material, each of which makes the quilt a bit heavier. Besides weight, how much does the fill power and/or material effect how small the quilt will be able to compress? I feel like that is another point I'd like to consider, besides weight and price. I've recently switched to a smaller backpack, and space is even more critical for me now. When I see it on paper, it doesn't seem like a huge difference at all... for example:

LL's 10* Ghost Pepper (52" wide, 70" long): 900 fill / 13oz fill weight / 19.1oz total weight
LL's 10* Serrano (52" wide, 70" long): 800 fill / 14oz fill weight / 20.2oz total weight
(Note: I know another difference between these two quilts is their baffle style... not sure that factors into my choice here because I have no experience with any of the baffle styles, so I have nothing really to compare it to!)

HG's 10* Burrow (50" wide, 69" long): 850 fill / 13.3oz fill weight / 19.84oz total weight
HG's 10* Burrow Econ (50" wide, 69" long): 800 fill / 14.4oz fill weight / 23.3oz total weight

It's hard to justify the extra cost of the regular models which weigh only a few ounces more (especially Loco Libre's, only weighting 1 oz more!)... but if the 900 fill also compresses a bit smaller, than I might be willing to spend that difference. If it's really not noticeable, then perhaps the economy quilt would be the way to go for me.

To be clear, I know that going with any of these vendors and any of these options will be an extreme improvement over my sleeping bag and I'll be happy with any of it! I can see that the differences here are small; however, I don't have the funds, nor can I justify multiple TQ purchases, so I'm really just trying to make the best, educated decision possible for my needs.

I appreciate any insight those of you with experience may be able to give me regarding the fill differences and any other considerations I may have missed. Thanks!

[kitsapcowboy]

t's hard to justify the extra cost of the regular models which weigh only a few ounces more (especially Loco Libre's, only weighting 1 oz more!)... but if the 900 fill also compresses a bit smaller, than I might be willing to spend that difference. If it's really not noticeable, then perhaps the economy quilt would be the way to go for me.

A 900FP down quilt should compresses about 11% smaller than an 800FP down quilt. Obviously, this makes less difference on smaller, lighter quilts (that contain less down). I wish I could look at shorter 70" long quilts like you do; those carry weights are very attractive at any fill power.

[rweb82]

Not to make your decision even harder, but Wilderness Logics also offers a "budget" line of top quilts and underquilts. Their prices are excellent, and shipping is flat-rate $6.95. I ordered a Saver-Series UQ from Loco Libre (hopefully it will get made next week!), and will order a Saver/Econ/Budget top quilt in the Fall- after I've saved up the money for it. IMO, the differences between the regular vs. econ lines is so small, it doesn't justify the additional cost. If I had a larger budget, my opinion may change; but it may not.

While I don't own a "regular" version of any of these top quilts, I believe compressability would be very similar. Someone posted a side-by-side of his Econ Hammock Gear quilt and regular HG quilt, and there wasn't much difference. I believe these vendors are using the same stuff sacks for both their regular and econ/budget/saver lines.

As for the differences in fill power, it takes more ounces 800fp down to make a 20 degree quilt than if you used 900fp. That said, both quilts should perform the same at the rated temperatures, and the weight difference is not that great. Also, Loco Libre already uses 800fp duck down as standard in their regular line; so the only real difference between that and their Saver Series is the fabric. Wilderness Logics Budget quilts use a blend of 850fp goose down and 800fp duck down, while their premium quilts use 900fp goose down. The Hammock Gear Econ line has the most drastic difference in down between their regular and econ lines.

These manufacturers sure don't make it easy for us to decide! But regardless of what you choose, you will have made a wise choice, nonetheless. Let us know what you decide to go with!

[souperjen24]

A 900FP down quilt should compresses about 11% smaller than an 800FP down quilt. Obviously, this makes less difference on smaller, lighter quilts (that contain less down). I wish I could look at shorter 70" long quilts like you do; those carry weights are very attractive at any fill power.

Thanks, Kit! I know that by looking at a 10*, I'm already going to have a bigger quilt... that 11% could make a difference.

I've looked at all of the different lengths and widths and how much the weight goes up with more material...it really does make a difference. I was tempted to get the quilt a bit longer than 70" because I like to put it over my face when I'm cold (almost always) and I wanted to make sure I'd have no problem doing that... but I'm 5'3, which is 63" ... so I have to believe that 70" will get the job done

[kitsapcowboy]

I concur; my rule of thumb is that user height + 6" makes a generous top quilt length, so you should be good to go.

[souperjen24]

Not to make your decision even harder, but Wilderness Logics also offers a "budget" line of top quilts and underquilts. Their prices are excellent, and shipping is flat-rate $6.95. I ordered a Saver-Series UQ from Loco Libre (hopefully it will get made next week!), and will order a Saver/Econ/Budget top quilt in the Fall- after I've saved up the money for it. IMO, the differences between the regular vs. econ lines is so small, it doesn't justify the additional cost. If I had a larger budget, my opinion may change; but it may not.

While I don't own a "regular" version of any of these top quilts, I believe compressability would be very similar. Someone posted a side-by-side of his Econ Hammock Gear quilt and regular HG quilt, and there wasn't much difference. I believe these vendors are using the same stuff sacks for both their regular and econ/budget/saver lines.

As for the differences in fill power, it takes more ounces 800fp down to make a 20 degree quilt than if you used 900fp. That said, both quilts should perform the same at the rated temperatures, and the weight difference is not that great. Also, Loco Libre already uses 800fp duck down as standard in their regular line; so the only real difference between that and their Saver Series is the fabric. Wilderness Logics Budget quilts use a blend of 850fp goose down and 800fp duck down, while their premium quilts use 900fp goose down. The Hammock Gear Econ line has the most drastic difference in down between their regular and econ lines.

These manufacturers sure don't make it easy for us to decide! But regardless of what you choose, you will have made a wise choice, nonetheless. Let us know what you decide to go with!

Gahhh. I'll have to check that out, maybe add it as an option to my spreadsheet. If you don't mind me asking, what made you decide to order a Loco Libre quilt (and save for another) if you have the Wilderness Logics? Just need a different temp or have been wanting a LL brand one for a while?

I don't know if you saw in my little comparison, but the down I was looking to get with the regular Loco Libre TQ was the 900 fill, not the 800. Especially with the sale they have going on right now, there really wasn't much of a difference in price between the two. With the sale, a 10* Ghost Pepper, 900 fill would be $252.45 ... the 10* Serrano with 800 fill would be $174, with a 1oz weight difference. Not sure I can justify the extra cost!

[rweb82]

Gahhh. I'll have to check that out, maybe add it as an option to my spreadsheet. If you don't mind me asking, what made you decide to order a Loco Libre quilt (and save for another) if you have the Wilderness Logics? Just need a different temp or have been wanting a LL brand one for a while?

I don't know if you saw in my little comparison, but the down I was looking to get with the regular Loco Libre TQ was the 900 fill, not the 800. Especially with the sale they have going on right now, there really wasn't much of a difference in price between the two. With the sale, a 10* Ghost Pepper, 900 fill would be $252.45 ... the 10* Serrano with 800 fill would be $174, with a 1oz weight difference. Not sure I can justify the extra cost!

Ah, I see where you were going there. With the sale, if the price difference isn't too great, the 900fp would probably be a great option. On LL's website, the standard prices correlate to the 800fp- which is why I referenced it that way. I do not own the WL quilt. I had already ordered my Saver Series UQ from LL before I saw that WL was now offering a budget line. Obviously, both vendors make awesome gear, so it basically just comes down to preference and/or price. I think WL budget line is the most affordable; but LL Saver Series offers the most customization. I'm just not sure if LL is still going to be offering the Saver Series line when I'm ready to purchase a new top quilt.

[sqidmark]

... but I'm 5'3, which is 63" ... so I have to believe that 70" will get the job done

My wife and I are 5'3" and 5'4". We find that 70" is about perfect.

[T- Minus]

If your going for a FKT, or a long Thru-hike, every ounce matters. If your of wealth, have money burning a hole in your pocket or a gear junkie that has to have the best, price really does not matter that much. If your body size/ frame/ weight , different issues will arise out of different gear and having options may make you a customer. So where am I going with this.....Some gear is just not for you, it can be, but knowing you, your limitations, and your wallet will allow you to get what you really need. It is all a individual needs issue, along with the market accepting the fact that it has to stay competitive.
Personally larger # fill power really gets its value at lower temps, and when space is at a premium: Zero and below
Some companies will not do custom work on budget gear, so if you have special needs that need to be addressed ask.
Some fabrics may only be available, same with colors, and some will work with your materials so also ask.
But my experience with HG, regular/premium custom gear and econ gear are great. The folks over there are top notch in my book. And while that may seem a little bias, I admit it is. I have not felt the need to change it up after I have had so many reasons to stay a loyal customer. But I am sure other vendors offer the same or similar quality with their products.
Last and not least Time to get what you need when you need it, if that is important that should also be addressed.
So in summery it really depends on you, your time, your needs, how it pairs with current or pending gear purchases, the cost and relationship with your vendor.

[georgecarr]

LL's 10* Ghost Pepper (52" wide, 70" long): 900 fill / 13oz fill weight / 19.1oz total weight
LL's 10* Serrano (52" wide, 70" long): 800 fill / 14oz fill weight / 20.2oz total weight
(Note: I know another difference between these two quilts is their baffle style... not sure that factors into my choice here because I have no experience with any of the baffle styles, so I have nothing really to compare it to!)

Can't compare the two. The Serrano is similar to the other economy quilts, but the Ghost Pepper is a premium quilt. The chevron baffles control down shift infinitely better than straight baffles.

If you want a bare bones quilt, any of the economy quilts will fill the bill. If you are looking for more options in fabric, down and colors then you should be looking at a premium quilt. It depends on your wants and budget.