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  1. #1
    Senior Member BigCRO's Avatar
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    UP Synthetic Insulation VS Down: A Fight to the Death

    Here at Cedar Ridge we have been working with UP Synthetic Insulation for awhile now. We get asked a lot about UP Synthetic’s moisture management characteristics and it’s ability to insulate when wetted through.
    We’ve heard some chatter lately that there just isn’t any benefit of Synthetic Insulation over down and as much as we love our down quilts that’s just not true. We decided to do a series of comparison videos to highlight UP Synthetic’s advantages over down and over other current synthetics on the market.

    First up is comparison of UP, Untreated 850FP Down, and Treated DownTek 850FP Down and their reactions to water and Loft after a 30 second water shake test.



    From Dutchware:
    UP is a performance-oriented technical insulation that is lightweight, compressible and completely water resistant. UP has maximum warmth and can be used in large baffles in places where consistent dampness and compression can potentially be damaging to down.
    UP insulation feature a unique synthetic cluster built around the finest water resistant fibers of varying deniers and composition to mimic the natural down cluster better than any existing blowable synthetic on the market. By using deniers ranging in size – some smaller than one denier – the UP cluster is able to bind to each other better to provide more warmth and greater durability. Much like down, UP works by trapping air providing maximum insulation for a given weight.

    ~BigCRO
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  2. #2
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Hey BigCro, thanks for the comparison testing! It is great to hear from folks who offer both and thus should be relatively unbiased. But this is the same video that is already being discussed in a current and new thread, no?

    But one thing I hope you guys will give us some info on: A 1.5" thick Climashield UQ is as warm as a significantly thicker down UQ, a well over 2" thick down UQ. Also, some 20 oz Climashield UQs are about as warm as some down UQs that are not much lighter, maybe an oz or 2 at most, especially when you are looking at the 3 season or less quilts. The weight dif seems to be greater once you get much below 20F.

    Does any of that also apply to UP insulation? IOW, in the video the 2 quilts at the end look about the same thickness. Are they? If so, is the 10 oz heavier quilt also warmer, as I would expect with an equal thickness Climashield quilt?

    Thanks for testing this stuff for us!

  3. #3
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    UP Synthetic Insulation VS Down: A Fight to the Death

    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    Hey BigCro, thanks for the comparison testing! It is great to hear from folks who offer both and thus should be relatively unbiased. But this is the same video that is already being discussed in a current and new thread, no?

    But one thing I hope you guys will give us some info on: A 1.5" thick Climashield UQ is as warm as a significantly thicker down UQ, a well over 2" thick down UQ. Also, some 20 oz Climashield UQs are about as warm as some down UQs that are not much lighter, maybe an oz or 2 at most, especially when you are looking at the 3 season or less quilts. The weight dif seems to be greater once you get much below 20F.

    Does any of that also apply to UP insulation? IOW, in the video the 2 quilts at the end look about the same thickness. Are they? If so, is the 10 oz heavier quilt also warmer, as I would expect with an equal thickness Climashield quilt?

    Thanks for testing this stuff for us!
    It is the same video, but I shared it unofficially from CRO :-)


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  4. #4
    Senior Member BigCRO's Avatar
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    UP Synthetic Insulation VS Down: A Fight to the Death

    Quote Originally Posted by BillyBob58 View Post
    Hey BigCro, thanks for the comparison testing! It is great to hear from folks who offer both and thus should be relatively unbiased. But this is the same video that is already being discussed in a current and new thread, no?

    But one thing I hope you guys will give us some info on: A 1.5" thick Climashield UQ is as warm as a significantly thicker down UQ, a well over 2" thick down UQ. Also, some 20 oz Climashield UQs are about as warm as some down UQs that are not much lighter, maybe an oz or 2 at most, especially when you are looking at the 3 season or less quilts. The weight dif seems to be greater once you get much below 20F.

    Does any of that also apply to UP insulation? IOW, in the video the 2 quilts at the end look about the same thickness. Are they? If so, is the 10 oz heavier quilt also warmer, as I would expect with an equal thickness Climashield quilt?

    Thanks for testing this stuff for us!
    I’m not aware of a thread discussing this video. We just uploaded it yesterday and I hadn’t had a chance to make a post here until now.

    You are correct that both quilts are about the same thickness. The preliminary testing is that you will need a comparable amount of loft as a down quilt to achieve the same temperature rating. We ran out of cold weather last winter to really push it to the limits but we will resume the punishment again this winter. We did get to test at 30°F with 30°F UP Quilts and they performed well at a low of 26°F. We will push these to the limit this year and adjust loft if the fill allows. There is some research suggesting that UP will perform in a similar manner to Climashield (less loft for the same warmth) but we have not gotten there yet.

    Part of the weight difference in the quilts is material. The down quilt is made with Argon .90 and Argon .67 while the UP is made with ION 1.1 (mainly to keep the price down). I showed have mentioned that in the video, sorry.

    Our next video is going to be a compression comparison of UP, Down, and Climashield.
    Last edited by BigCRO; 10-26-2019 at 12:23.
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  5. #5
    Senior Member TrailSlug's Avatar
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  6. #6
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Thanks, BigCro.

  7. #7
    Senior Member BigCRO's Avatar
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    Here is the second video comparing the compression of UP Synthetic Insulation as compared to Down and Climashield.

    Sometimes nothing is a pretty cool hand.
    -Coolhand Luke-
    http://cedarridgegear.com/
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  8. #8
    Senior Member BillyBob58's Avatar
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    Thanks, BigCro!

  9. #9
    big thanks for this BigCRO. i have been looking for information like this since i first saw your quilts a couple of months back. i think the next round of tests will be key for me - durability after compression, also consistency of distribution after repeated use.

    i'm already thinking strongly about this stuff for really cold weather, but i was suprised to see the climashield compress so much less at 20f ratings too. 20f is probably for me the temperature where durability trumps all else as it'll be getting by far the most use

  10. #10
    Senior Member Alamosa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCRO View Post
    Here is the second video comparing the compression of UP Synthetic Insulation as compared to Down and Climashield.
    I wonder if using a vacuum with one of those compression bags would allow you to get some kind of consistent measurement on compressibility - based on the vacuum being a constant.
    We must, indeed, all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately. - Ben Franklin
    (known as a win-win on this forum)

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