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Thread: DIY Wooki

  1. #21
    Senior Member PharmGeek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by echinotrix View Post

    @PharmGeek: How did you determine how much down has to go into each chamber? Can you post the links to your forum posts? I can't find them. Thanks.
    arrrrrg! Well...I kinda spit balled it more or less..but had a certain methodology in mind to start with.

    1st - I recalled in my mind reading that Brandon uses 10 oz of down in the 3 season wooki....so 10oz divided by 9 baffles = about 1.1 oz per baffle. So I mean, that I saw as a point of reference or starting point or "benchmark" if you will...

    2nd - I have no earthly idea how to calculate the volume of each chamber...doing the "catsplat" type spreadsheet to include the geometry and volume of standard baffle including that is weird enough, but introducing a odd sorta shape like these are....I just am not sure how to do that math frankly...there is likely easy calculations for such a shaped cube where in you enter several dimensions and out pops the number, but combining that math with the stuff we see with catsplat and all iterations since....no clue.

    SO....

    3rd....I calculated the volume of the longest baffle using rough "middle" baffle width value...and a vaguely estimated height of the baffle...my baffles at their lowest point would be 3 inches where they attach...and at their highest I just was not sure...so I split the difference. My math as I recall looked like this: 4 inches wide times 4 inches tall times 78 inches long (I think that was my longest baffle as I recall) = 1,238(volume)...divide that by fill power (850) = 1.46 oz's - I multiplied that by 1.15 (adding 15%) just as another fudge factor so that is 1.68....the other baffles that vary in length, I merely took the percentage difference in length and reduced the volume according to that change in length.

    4th - I used many magic clips after stuffing and fluffed up the down as best I could - let it set a couple hours...examined how full each baffle looked...a couple looked a tad anemic...I stuffed those each with an extra quarter oz...and then sewed it up.

    Seems to worked out ok so far...I think I overdid it, but im ok with that...it fluffs up at least to 3 inches minimum as I measure loft...but upwards of 4.5 inchces depending on how I shift the down around...I think my head in max loft is more than other areas. That is measuring the loft while laying flat on ground.

    Once I hang it...the loft appears to be unaffected, but I find it hard to measure loft while it is hung (ideas??)...

    btw...when I cut my outer shell...I did so in a way that if at width point X on the quilted area where you sew it down...if it is 42 inches wide lets say...I added not only the differential width to the outer shell, but the baffle height to account for verticle travel of the fabric at both sides...so as I recall, my width differential was added 6 inches...and the loft was perhaps estimated at 3.5 inches...so I distributed 6 inches added baffle width between each of the baffles...but also added 3 inches at each side of the fabric to account for verticle "wall" travel.....coincidentally, those side baffles are the ones that looked a tad anemic upon first attempt stuffing them...

    Keep in mind...I am spit balling here...I have no earthly clue, lol....

    Im actually quite happy with this build....

    One thing I will do different next time is PLANNING EXACTLY where I put the pleats...both those pleats in the baffle material coordinated with where I pleat the outer shell material....I kinda "winged" it, and just put down but concentrated some at the feet where there is a marked bend from flat to nearly straight up...and was sure to put pleats at where the butt is and a bit at the head...as I placed them, I would intermittently check how much excess I have at the end stretching it all out while still in the machine to keep track...if that makes sense.

    Next time, as I draw out all my marks for baffle placement...I will as well, mark where exactly I plan to put or concentrate any and all pleats
    “The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.”

  2. #22
    Senior Member PharmGeek's Avatar
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    The result of someone less organized pleating, caused some minor aestetic pulling of the fabric at some diagonal lines....its no biggie...but a tad less elegant in a couple spots.
    “The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.”

  3. #23
    Senior Member echinotrix's Avatar
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    Thank you for explaining, PharmGeek.

    It is very interesting to see how different people's approaches are. I had IT help:

    First I traced the dimensions of the original Wooki in Inkscape. Then I added an additional chamber, determined the area of each chamber (a feature to do this is available in the program) and calculated the area share in percentages of each chamber.

    Wooki_bunt_10_Kammern.jpg

    With regard to the total amount of down, I did it like you and took a look at on the data of Warbonnet (10 ounces in the 3-season Wooki). To find out how much more down I need because of the extra chamber, I just looked at how much larger the area of my wokie is compared to the original (+15%), so I chose 11.5 ounces of down. I then spread the down among the chambers according to the respective area proportions.
    I have chosen the height of the chambers as usual for most commercial 3-season underquilts.

    Quote Originally Posted by PharmGeek View Post
    Once I hang it...the loft appears to be unaffected, but I find it hard to measure loft while it is hung (ideas??)...
    Maybe like this: Lie down in the hammock and let a second person pierce through the insulation to the skin (but not further ) with a very thin wire (<0.1 mm). Mark the penetration depth on the wire, then simply measure it.

    The difficulty is to find a wire that is so thin that the fabric is not damaged. But should be possible.
    Last edited by echinotrix; 11-30-2017 at 02:39.

  4. #24
    Senior Member PharmGeek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by echinotrix View Post
    Thank you for explaining, PharmGeek.

    It is very interesting to see how different people's approaches are. I had IT help:

    First I traced the dimensions of the original Wooki in Inkscape. Then I added an additional chamber, determined the area of each chamber (a feature to do this is available in the program) and calculated the area share in percentages of each chamber.

    Wooki_bunt_10_Kammern.jpg

    With regard to the total amount of down, I did it like you and took a look at on the data of Warbonnet (10 ounces in the 3-season Wooki). To find out how much more down I need because of the extra chamber, I just looked at how much larger the area of my wokie is compared to the original (+15%), so I chose 11.5 ounces of down. I then spread the down among the chambers according to the respective area proportions.
    I have chosen the height of the chambers as usual for most commercial 3-season underquilts.



    Maybe like this: Lie down in the hammock and let a second person pierce through the insulation to the skin (but not further ) with a very thin wire (<0.1 mm). Mark the penetration depth on the wire, then simply measure it.

    The difficulty is to find a wire that is so thin that the fabric is not damaged. But should be possible.
    Wow!! You were more sophisticated than I was! Also the wire idea is great! I will pursue that for sure...

    For the time being I put my wife in it and just felt around under there and I felt “very fluffy” without exception - sound x rated I know


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    “The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.”

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by PharmGeek View Post
    For the time being I put my wife in it and just felt around under there and I felt “very fluffy” without exception - sound x rated I know


    I have plans to recruit my husband to help with measuring for a proper area... hadn't considered it could turn into 'date night'...!

  6. #26
    Senior Member PharmGeek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by echinotrix View Post

    First I traced the dimensions of the original Wooki in Inkscape. Then I added an additional chamber, determined the area of each chamber (a feature to do this is available in the program) and calculated the area share in percentages of each chamber.
    Follow up question if you do not mind!

    I want to use this program you speak of...I used a horribly crude method to cut my outer shell materials:

    I used the wooki to mark the area of the DIY job...that was easy enough.

    Then to make the outer fabric...I took the inner marking I just made...and used a square at each intersection and marked it the according added length and width....then I took some masking tape and used that to connect those new dots...then taped my fabric for the outer layer cut over top of that tape outline and used a piece of soap and it traced easily along the edge of the tape...kinda like creating a small imprint and shading in around that line created nice lines. I did not add any width of course to the center line marks...so it all was kinda winging it to a degree....lol. but that program...if I had used that...it could precisely allow me to increase the dimensions and give measurements with more precision for the outer shell...you have inspired me! need to figure that one out!

    And knowing the area...is there not then an easy way to take the area...and then just plug in the height and give a rough estimate of the volume of that shape...roughly...? good to have the 10 oz benchmark and do what you did...very nice....very interesting.

    Thanks a million for your insights!
    “The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.”

  7. #27
    Senior Member echinotrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PharmGeek View Post
    I want to use this program you speak of...
    Okay, I'll try to explain this and hope that I can express myself in an understandable way. Since I am not a native speaker, I'm sure some passages are a bit bumpy, but I'll try to do my best.

    The program I used is called Inkscape, you can find it here. It's a vector graphics program, i. e. you create objects such as lines, curves, rectangles or other geometric shapes, somewhat similar to Powerpoint. Any other dedicated vector graphics program will also work (Adobe Illustrator, Corel Draw).

    First I created a rectangle in the size of the carrier fabric. Here its best to change the size units in Inkscape from the standard "Pixel" to centimeters (or inches), this can be found at the top of the menu bar of the various tools. This means that the subsequent calculations are carried out in the desired unit. If you only want percentage values, then that doesn't matter, you can leave it on pixels - relative values are dimensionless.

    Then I traced the outline of the isolated area. The measuring tool helps you to transfer previously determined dimensions exactly, if you had an original for measuring (as in my case). I then took the outline of the original Wooki that I had just drawn, turned it vertically, widened it by one chamber (about 4 inches), turned it back to its original angle and put it back on the rectangle. The slightly larger object is of course a bit overhanging, I removed the excess parts.

    Then I measured the width of the adapted insulated area and divided it by 10. This enabled me to create guidelines to mark the chamber progressions (actually I made this step a little more elegant, but I don't know how to explain it). Then I outlined each chamber, so that I got a single object for each chamber. The area of these objects can then easily be determined in Inkscape (see here).

    The total area of the insulation was determined analogously with the previously created outline. This enabled me to calculate the percentage area parts of the individual chambers which I used to determine the amount of down in each chamber.

    I hope that was reasonably understandable. A video would be much better, but also a lot more time comsuming to produce. If you have any questions, just let me know.

  8. #28
    Senior Member PharmGeek's Avatar
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    Quite understandable....but yeah, it will take some time to likely work out the details...I need to find a way to use a program to plot it all out...I ended up not widening the insulated area...not a "big deal"....im actually making a trade with another DIY'er for another very interesting item (im not allowed to discuss until a later point) for my wooki copy...I think on my 3rd attempt I am gonna widen a bit on the left just by about 4 inches or so. I need to look more closely at this build again, but I think for how I lay, I need or could get away with a tad less of the insulation on the far right side (im a head left, feet right lay)...the wooki's length overall for my height is nearly perfect from an efficiency standpoint, but I may add a couple inches to it as it can be a bit close for my taste there.

    This is too fun...the progression I am making is engaging....I mean, its just for fun but I have found this stuff rewarding.

    I want to perhaps later make a similar such UQ for my DIY bridge. Thankfully it will be a freaking rectangle and require far less differential I assume.
    “The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We are made of starstuff.”

  9. #29

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    Very good info, thanks, echinotrix! (And your English is excellent.)

    I'd been thinking a lot about eyeballing and messing with the fabric vs. using some sort of design program... a friend had told me about another option, called OnShape, that looks promising, if complicated. I don't want to spend more time learning a program than actually building a quilt! Unless, of course, doing so would avoid a DIY disaster.

    In the end I'll probably use some combination of digital and 'analogue' methods.

  10. #30
    Senior Member echinotrix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PharmGeek View Post
    This is too fun...the progression I am making is engaging....I mean, its just for fun but I have found this stuff rewarding.
    I feel the same way. And with every DIY project I have more and more admiration for the performance of our cottage vendors (especially Warbonnet). It's only then that you realize how much development work there is in the products. On the other hand, professionals have completely different possibilities than amateurs. I can imagine that in products like the Wooki dozens of prototypes were built before the thing goes on the market. Of course, private individuals cannot do this. Yet, you still have to have the ideas first - and some of them are really all about thinking out of the box. In the past I have already thought about hanging an "insulated hammock" under a normal hammock, but from there it is still a long way to what Warbonnet "invented". And then you still have to be able to produce it at marketable prices. That's a completely different thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by KBr00ks View Post
    Very good info, thanks. A friend had told me about another option, called OnShape, that looks promising, if complicated.
    I have no experience with CAD programs. I think that this might also be a bit overkill for this specific application. However, if you could learn to use the programm properly and take into account the elongation of the fabric and things like the curvature of the chambers, the calculations would be quite precise. Still a lot to learn out there. A lot of fun, the whole thing.

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