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  1. #1
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    1 very expensive tarp or 2 mildly expensive tarps? ( Winter car camping in Central Texas )

    Hi there,

    I'm new to this forum and also new to camping in general since I've only gone twice in my lifetime. I have decided to purchase my own gear so that I can spend more time in the outdoors. Some research was done, but I realize that there is much information to consume....

    Hammock camping sounds great since I can possibly load up the motorcycle for some trips. Therefore, I am leaning towards spending money on tarp(s) and eventually underquilt/topquilt. For now, I have a tent and will slowly build out my camping gear.

    At the moment, car camping is what I have in mind until I'm more equipped to hike to primitive campsites (1-5 mile hikes).

    With winter camping in mind, should I pick up a 12ft and 16ft Kelty Noah tarp for versatility as well as doubling up the tent layers? Or should I just purchase a single tent like the Warbonnet SuperFly tarp?

  2. #2
    Senior Member AdventureMyk's Avatar
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    I have the Kelty 12 and its not ultra light but it is huge, strong, and budget friendly. I got it for motorcycle and kayak camping where its big enough to shelter the hammock and bike. I also have a pair of lighter and not too much smaller silnyloyn tarps (vertex and a the biggest Hennessey which the name escapes me). They are certainly more compact and substantially lighter.

    If budget is a big concern I would start with the Kelty 12. It may be plenty big enough and save the balance of funds for other items or for the 16 *if* you find you need one that big. The Kelty is also strong enough yet soft enough to last for years, has all the pull-outs, etc. It is simply a great design.

    Car camping means weight isn't a huge issue but if you plan to backpack buying the lighter gear up front makes sense. Weight and size are more an issue when motorcycle camping, especially as I hit the trails on a dual sport to get where I want to camp though you didn't say what kind of bike. Just figure anything that works great on backpacking will carry over to motorcycles well and kayak/canoes even more so.

    I'd love to get the warbonnet and do the pole mod but that's a few steps down the road for $$$ reasons. As for size vs $$ you will find a lot of Kelty fans on this forum. The only real demerit is their weight.

  3. #3
    Senior Member xrayit's Avatar
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    I own the Kelty Noah 12 ft, Warbonnet Superfly and MJ. All have specific uses for me depending on where and what type of camping I will be doing. The warbonnet tarps pack small and weigh less than half the weight of the Kelty. The Kelty 12 tarp has a big pack size and is quite heavy but is bomb proof with lots of room and actually for the price a nice general use tarp. I bought a Noah 16 and found that it was way too big for me so I gave it away the 16 is a massive tarp.

  4. #4
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    The Warbonnet Superfly (19.1 oz.) is not a "very expensive tarp." You want very expensive? Buy an HG Winter Palace cuben fiber tarp (8.6 oz.) at $395.

    If weight is no concern, then a couple of Kelty's will work fine. Just keep in mind that the Kelty's are heavy: Their website says you're looking at 2 lbs. 3 ounces (35 ounces) for the Noah 12 and 3 lbs. 10 oz. (53 ounces) for the Noah 16. So if 5 lbs. 13 oz. of tarp doesn't bother you, get both. However, if you're alone, I don't see why you would need two massive tarps like that.
    "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." Ralph Waldo Emerson

  5. #5
    Senior Member AdventureMyk's Avatar
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    Oh, if I was going to start with just one tarp to do it all I would likely go with the Warbonnet superfly and add the pole mod when I could. On this forum if you found you weren't happy there would be a line of people willing to take them off your hands for a good price.

  6. #6
    Senior Member oldpappy's Avatar
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    Since your usage is via auto and hiking is limited to 1-5 miles, I'd get the Kelty 12 and spend your saved $$ on insulation. Kelty 12 is solid and can be configured for winter use.
    Enjoying the simple things in life -
    Own less, live more.

  7. #7
    Senior Member WalksIn2Trees's Avatar
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    Never really looked into them before...68D Polyester, yes heavy stuff... they also make the Noah in 16×16 and 20×20. And theres that's more like a winter tarp that's 11x11 footprint. (If your on a motorcycle I wouldn't do it, not because of weight... a couple of pounds won't slow a motorcycle down... but because of the bulk, especially if you want two... you'll want the room in your bags for other things. I'm on a bicycle, and I find that the bulk is my biggest enemy I just ordered a 13ft Old Man Winter from Wilderness Logics, myself, and it's going to be bulkier than my Bullfrog, but is also going to be about half or less as bulky as similarly sized products made with the materials that Kelty uses.

    Sent from my SM-T817V using Tapatalk

  8. #8
    Senior Member AngryDaddyBird's Avatar
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    WB Superfly with outside pole mod is what I am looking for.
    Based on your use I'd say the kelty 12 is perfect. I had one for yearss and its never let me down! Never should have gave it away.

  9. #9
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    Wow. I love this forum. Everyone is so helpful!!

    Quote Originally Posted by AdventureMyk View Post
    I have the Kelty 12 ... for motorcycle and kayak camping where its big enough to shelter the hammock and bike.

    It may be plenty big enough and save the balance of funds for other items or for the 16 *if* you find you need one that big.

    Weight and size are more an issue when motorcycle camping, especially as I hit the trails on a dual sport to get where I want to camp though you didn't say what kind of bike.

    ...
    Oh, if I was going to start with just one tarp to do it all I would likely go with the Warbonnet superfly and add the pole mod when I could.
    I figured having 2 tarps would be very useful since I'm always busy studying. Even though I'm getting away from the seriousness of life, I can't disconnect completely from my books. The convenience and flexibility of having solitude, nature, hike trails, food, drinks, kitchen, picnic table, bathroom, and sometimes a swimming hole within a stones throw is a great benefit for my 3-day weekends.

    The 16ft tarp would cover most of the picnic table to ensure I always have adequate coverage in case it rains and I need to cook under it. Whereas, the 12ft tarp will cover the tent/hammock for those lighter motorcycle trips or inclement weather. You're right about saving money though; underquilts are terribly expensive for this peon.. With goals of camping once every other month, weather just cannot dictate my maneuvers.

    At the moment, I ride a Kawasaki Ninja 300, so space is a luxury. Saddle bags and pinion rack are also in my long list of purchases, so I won't go motorcycle camping for another year or so. If the Kelty 12' works well enough for your motorcycle trips, I presume it'll work well for me.

    I can see how weight might be important when you're hitting the trails on the motorcycle. No one wants to feel like a Hayabusa while riding a dual-sport bike. My bike could handle fire roads, at most..

    The SuperFly pole mode is enticing since I may consider bridge hammocks when I get more serious about year-round camping. There's nothing wrong with sleeping comfortably while creating a thick skin, right??

    Quote Originally Posted by xrayit View Post
    I own the Kelty Noah 12 ft, Warbonnet Superfly and MJ. All have specific uses for me depending on where and what type of camping I will be doing. The warbonnet tarps pack small and weigh less than half the weight of the Kelty. The Kelty 12 tarp has a big pack size and is quite heavy but is bomb proof with lots of room and actually for the price a nice general use tarp. I bought a Noah 16 and found that it was way too big for me so I gave it away the 16 is a massive tarp.
    ? How comfortable would the Kelty 12ft vs 16ft be across a picnic table during inclement weather ??

    I've heard that the vertical/horizontal measurements from the center are 2ft less than perimeter measurments. This would pose an issue when wrapping the Kelty 12ft with doors around an 11ft hammock.

    Since I'm merely starting off, I don't know how serious I would get into backpacking/motorcycle-camping yet. I'm slow-playing this at a moderate pace if that makes sense. I think some might call this characteristic, impulsive.

    Quote Originally Posted by SilvrSurfr View Post
    The Warbonnet Superfly (19.1 oz.) is not a "very expensive tarp." You want very expensive? Buy an HG Winter Palace cuben fiber tarp (8.6 oz.) at $395.

    If weight is no concern, then a couple of Kelty's will work fine. Just keep in mind that the Kelty's are heavy: Their website says you're looking at 2 lbs. 3 ounces (35 ounces) for the Noah 12 and 3 lbs. 10 oz. (53 ounces) for the Noah 16. So if 5 lbs. 13 oz. of tarp doesn't bother you, get both. However, if you're alone, I don't see why you would need two massive tarps like that.
    Hah. You're making my wallet size seem so tiny now..

    Covering the hammock with one tarp and a picnic table with the other tarp was my thinking.

    Wow!! That Winter Place looks great though -- like mansion in the wilderness... However, $425 is waaaaaaaaay out of my reach though.

    Quote Originally Posted by WalksIn2Trees View Post
    you'll want the room in your bags for other things. I'm on a bicycle, and I find that the bulk is my biggest enemy I just ordered a 13ft Old Man Winter from Wilderness Logics, myself, and it's going to be bulkier than my Bullfrog, but is also going to be about half or less as bulky as similarly sized products made with the materials that Kelty uses.
    You've brought up a great point. I failed to mention that I may consider bike-camping to reach campsites more quickly (still need to purchase a bike rack since I sold the old bike rack with the old car). I think you've just sold me on reducing bulk since I plan on getting a car roof rack before getting motorcycle saddle bags and pinion rack.

    ? How do you feel about using a diamond-shaped tarp to cover a picnic table against inclement weather ??

    I might consider using this tarp (without doors) on fair weather days when I'm afforded ultimate solitude. This tent will save me $65 when not purchasing the Kelty 16ft.

    It's measurements are diagonal -- 11' 10'' x 9' 4'' ( each side should be 7' 6'' if my calculations are correct ). It might just be enough for an 11-foot hammock.

    Quote Originally Posted by AngryDaddyBird View Post
    WB Superfly with outside pole mod is what I am looking for.
    Based on your use I'd say the kelty 12 is perfect. I had one for yearss and its never let me down! Never should have gave it away.
    Bummer. The downside to looking out/after one's friends...

    . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== . ==== .

    By the way, having doors on the hammock would be preferable, so larger tarps will provide ample room within. I can only imagine how spaciously a 16ft or 20ft tarp would be.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Chriss's Avatar
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    Without reading through all of that..... which I am sure has lots of good points. If it were me and I could do it all over again, I would purchase the WBSF and be done.

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