Proposed changes to WTT Area

[dkurfiss]

Over the past few months the moderators and admins have been working to update the Market Place area with new guidelines. Many of the changes have come from the members of Hammock Forums and we would like to continue that with the changes what will be coming to the final Market Place area Want To Trade.

Below is what is under consideration. Your input would be appreciated. Any suggestions for changes, adds, removals to these rules will be given consideration. Not saying that all suggestions will get incorporated but all suggestions will be evaluated. Our goal is to make WTT rules more consistent with the rest of the Market Place, improve usability for the members while decreasing work load on the moderators. We are also looking to give the members more control by allowing them to not only open their threads but to close them when done, and move them from viewing area.

So, everything below this line is a cut/paste of what has been reworked.
__________________________________________________ ___

For Trade Forum Rules:

1. You must have a minimum of 50 posts to start a new WTT thread. There is no minimum to respond to a thread. There is no minimum to participate in the 'Want To Buy (WTB)' sub forum.

Attempts to circumvent the minimum 50 posts rule by posting rapidly to raise your post count is not allowed, and will result in loss of access to the Marketplace forums.

2. A member may only have one (1) WTT thread active at any one time and each thread is limited to three (3) items. Any active thread with more than 3 items listed will be deleted. Once a member closes and moves his thread to the sold area they can then open another thread with up to 3 items. If a member opens a 2nd thread, thereby having two threads active, both threads will be deleted.

3. All items in this forum are FOR TRADE only! Please do not offer to purchase items.

4. Items listed in the marketplace must be related to outdoors gear.
Guidelines for outdoor gear:
a) Hammocks
b) Hammock suspensions
c) Bug nets
d) Socks (over covers)
e) Tarps
f) Tarp suspension & stakes
g) Hardware to hang tarps, quilts, and hammocks
h) Under quilts (UQ), Top Quilts (TQ), & pads
i) Suspension or method to secure quilts or pad
j) Packs
k) Cook kits (pots, pans, stoves)
l) Water filtration including tubing, fittings
m) Outdoor Clothing
n) DIY supplies to make outdoor gear such as cordage, fabric, insulation, tubing, bladders
o) General Camp use knives are permitted. Buyer and seller are responsible for ensuring they comply with all local laws including size and age requirement when buying or selling knives.
p)Chairs or other camping furniture
q)Tents or items used for ground sleeping


Excluded (cannot be traded on HF)
a) Firearms, ammunition, or holsters for same
b) Fishing, skiing, pulks, or any other sporting gear
c) Electronic gear – if it requires power or batteries it cannot be traded on HF
d) Automatic knives, butterfly knives and swords

4. All discussion about trades are to be had in the individual For Trade thread. No PM discussion about trade offers please. By keeping the trade offers in the open forum, there can be no dispute.

5. Don't post items to trade unless you are ready to ship them within 72 hours. (Excepting only major holidays, or extraordinary circumstances.)

6. When items have been traded, please close and move the thread per instructions (link to be added to instructions)

7. Members that abuse the nature of the trading thread will be removed from participating.

8. No off topic discussions are allowed in WTT threads. Off topic discussion will be deleted at the moderator’s discretion. This includes but not limited to recommendations or reviews (good or bad) of items offered or chatter in the thread. Please limit conversations to offering item to trade or asking questions about the item offered.

9. Hammock Forums will not take sides in any dispute because of items not shipped, or other situations that may arise. This is for the membership to work out, let's act like adults please.

10. Bartering for trades is acceptable, as long as no money is exchanged between members.

11. When a trade is finished please note, what you traded, with whom you traded with and what you traded for.

12. WTT thread should be bump every 7 days. This allows the user base to know the item is still wanted and keeps it fresh in their viewing. It will also keep the moderators from removing your thread. Any thread not bumped in 7 days, will at the moderators discretion be marked inactive and removed without further notice.

Guidelines:

1. Use thoughtful caution when trading. Consider how long has the member been on the forum, and the value of the trade.

2. Communicate clearly, frequently, and calmly. This eliminates frustration for both parties.

3. Consider using a shipping method that can offer tracking or delivery confirmation. USPS Priority is a good option for U.S. addresses.


The Fine Print:

The Fine Print -

- Hammock Forums is not responsible for transactions or goods exchanged.

- If there is a dispute, please PM one of the moderators.

- The Marketplace forums are meant for individuals selling, buying or trading surplus or unwanted gear only. It is not a place for members to start their small business endeavors.

- Hammock Forums welcomes those who wish to offer a hammock related item or service to the other members of the forum. Those wishing to offer a hammock related service or product should first contact one of the moderation team to make your intentions known and then post relevant threads in the Other Vendors and Services sub forum.

- The Marketplace forums will be kept "tidy". Old threads deemed inactive must be moved to the inactive sub-forum, by the individual opening the thread once the transaction is completed.

[Trail Runner]

Looks solid to me.

[OutandBack]

One small typo. cannot be sold on HF, should be, cannot be traded on HF

Excluded (cannot be sold on HF)
a) Fire arms, ammunition, or holsters for same
b) Fishing, skiing, pulks, or any other sporting gear
c) Electronic gear – if it requires power or batteries it cannot be sold on HF
d) Automatic knives, butterfly knives and swords

[bog01]

One small typo. cannot be sold on HF, should be, cannot be traded on HF

Excluded (cannot be sold on HF)
a) Fire arms, ammunition, or holsters for same
b) Fishing, skiing, pulks, or any other sporting gear
c) Electronic gear – if it requires power or batteries it cannot be sold on HF
d) Automatic knives, butterfly knives and swords

And firearms is one word.

[dkurfiss]

thanks .... edits made

[Karla "with a k"]

I see one of the proposed exclusions is: c) Electronic gear – if it requires power or batteries it cannot be traded on HF

Why exclude these items?

I ask because I currently have an item up for trade, an ENO Twilight (string of LED lights). This set of lights is to hang off your tarp or ridgeline and uses batteries. This item would be excluded by these new rules and it seems like a perfectly good hammocking item.

[Benson Burner]

Do you have to be an adult? I mean sometimes I am in-mature but seriously. Is there an age limit? For this or selling forum

[Benson Burner]

Rules are good,hopefully they will make for overall improvement, thanks guys!

[Ratdog]

3 item limit - expand to 6 - 3 is a pain, when I'm selling or trading, I'm moving some stuff and limiting it to 3 items is a bit much, I understand not wanting 20 items, but don't see a problem w/ 4, 5, 6 or more if the thread is well managed by the OP. If there's an issue, gently guide the OP in the right direction

7 day bump limit - extend to 14 days - nothing wrong w/ the craigslist model of 30 days and done, not everyone is online checking HF 1x/week, some only check in now and again

conversation about 'good' items or performance - extend a little latitude, opinions matter and help bump people off the fence - I get limiting the off topic but if someone offers and opinion on one item while discussing the purchase/trade of another in the same post, no heartburn with that

Generally speaking it seems, anecdotally, that the FS/FT forums aren't as active or interesting as 12-24 months ago. Adjusting to change is one thing, but it's still not dialed in. Maybe more mods to help, mods for specific forums such as the FS/FT?

Exclusion of battery operated gear seems a bit silly, you can buy a stove but not a headlamp? meh I understand this is about hammocks but a LARGE part of this is hammock camping and camping related stuff shouldn't be so restricted.

On the Portal Page, maybe a dedicated feature box posting pics and partial description of FS/FT items, rolling through posts from the marketplace forum.

Mods - if you're going to use canned messages as responses, maybe show a little more love, so many new folks and the responses can be off putting. Much prefer personalized messages where possible. And if that seems like a lot off work, I go back to, add some more mods for the 'problem' areas. There are plenty of regulars.

No, "just tell me what you got" kind of posts, if you're going to trade, at least make a suggestion of items you would take in trade. Open trading still allowed but at least it's a starting point.

Problem Sellers/Traders - it was stated that the impetus for many of these changes were that some folks were taking advantage or perhaps abusing the privilege and using HF as a clearinghouse almost. Those handful of folk have caused sweeping changes, I'm not sure so much for the better. Yes, I understand workload was also an issue, but really, I wonder if dealing with a handful of specific individuals, restricting access to the forum for them, might have allowed the FS/FT area to continue to flourish as it once was and hopefully will again.

There are literally thousands of other forums that have marketplaces that have far far fewer restrictions and seem to do well enough. I say this in hopes that expanding the number of items, types of items, weekly activity requirement, all could be relaxed, modified and/or increased as suggested.

As always, appreciate everyone's efforts. Volunteer work is often thankless and never pays well.

[Zilla]

3 item limit - expand to 6 - 3 is a pain, when I'm selling or trading, I'm moving some stuff and limiting it to 3 items is a bit much, I understand not wanting 20 items, but don't see a problem w/ 4, 5, 6 or more if the thread is well managed by the OP. If there's an issue, gently guide the OP in the right direction

7 day bump limit - extend to 14 days - nothing wrong w/ the craigslist model of 30 days and done, not everyone is online checking HF 1x/week, some only check in now and again

conversation about 'good' items or performance - extend a little latitude, opinions matter and help bump people off the fence - I get limiting the off topic but if someone offers and opinion on one item while discussing the purchase/trade of another in the same post, no heartburn with that

Generally speaking it seems, anecdotally, that the FS/FT forums aren't as active or interesting as 12-24 months ago. Adjusting to change is one thing, but it's still not dialed in. Maybe more mods to help, mods for specific forums such as the FS/FT?

Exclusion of battery operated gear seems a bit silly, you can buy a stove but not a headlamp? meh I understand this is about hammocks but a LARGE part of this is hammock camping and camping related stuff shouldn't be so restricted.

On the Portal Page, maybe a dedicated feature box posting pics and partial description of FS/FT items, rolling through posts from the marketplace forum.

Mods - if you're going to use canned messages as responses, maybe show a little more love, so many new folks and the responses can be off putting. Much prefer personalized messages where possible. And if that seems like a lot off work, I go back to, add some more mods for the 'problem' areas. There are plenty of regulars.

No, "just tell me what you got" kind of posts, if you're going to trade, at least make a suggestion of items you would take in trade. Open trading still allowed but at least it's a starting point.

Problem Sellers/Traders - it was stated that the impetus for many of these changes were that some folks were taking advantage or perhaps abusing the privilege and using HF as a clearinghouse almost. Those handful of folk have caused sweeping changes, I'm not sure so much for the better. Yes, I understand workload was also an issue, but really, I wonder if dealing with a handful of specific individuals, restricting access to the forum for them, might have allowed the FS/FT area to continue to flourish as it once was and hopefully will again.

There are literally thousands of other forums that have marketplaces that have far far fewer restrictions and seem to do well enough. I say this in hopes that expanding the number of items, types of items, weekly activity requirement, all could be relaxed, modified and/or increased as suggested.

As always, appreciate everyone's efforts. Volunteer work is often thankless and never pays well.

I have to say that i totally agree with Ratdog on every thing on his list and for sure the fs section has lost it's appeal to most, it's just not what it used to be. the restrictions are alittle over done and could really use some relaxing .
Like i said when the original changes were talked about awhile back, punish the abusers and not the whole comunnity !!...It's easy to know who they are, same group of folks everytime, loosen up the reigns on the rest of us.