Becket Hitch Suspension; Idea and Questions

**Phantom Grappler** · 09-28-2015, 14:46

I'll have to get a rain check. Doctor did a heart catheterization this morning. And it's going great.

**SGT Rock** · 09-28-2015, 17:44

Ouch. Good luck!

**mophead** · 09-28-2015, 21:57

I have used the toggled bite with dynaglide leader and loops, tying around the thicker dia. part of the loops as you described. Works for me (sample size of one mind you). I tied the slippery half hitch backup when I did it.

Most of the wear I am seeing is on the CL. Although I think I'd agree with what phantom grappler said about the smooth toggle.

I'm not sure toggle diameter is going to make any huge difference unless we are very near the failure point. Maybe the added surface area will provide more grip. But I'm not sure you need a very large toggle. The smallest stick id consider using would be about 5-6x the diameter of dynaglide where its commonly recommended to use at least 2x. Actually, I'm not sure this would follow the usual larger diameter=better protocol. A larger toggle means the angle where the lead exits the bite is more acute. I'm not sure if this would be better or not. Maybe we should toggle in a way like dutch recommends his tree strap clips where the strap comes off more or less tangent to the side of the tree? Or maybe everyone's been doing this already and I'm just now figuring it out....

**Theguywitheyebrows** · 09-28-2015, 22:17

thinking about the smallishness of the dynaglide being a problem has me thinking: pull the dynaglide through a shortish piece of amsteel to use as a cover for the dynaglide where it bends/gets bent over the most? just a thought, tossed out in a stream...might catch and build an island, but not if i don't let it free.

**SGT Rock** · 09-29-2015, 02:51

Originally Posted by mophead

I have used the toggled bite with dynaglide leader and loops, tying around the thicker dia. part of the loops as you described. Works for me (sample size of one mind you). I tied the slippery half hitch backup when I did it.

Most of the wear I am seeing is on the CL. Although I think I'd agree with what phantom grappler said about the smooth toggle.

I'm not sure toggle diameter is going to make any huge difference unless we are very near the failure point. Maybe the added surface area will provide more grip. But I'm not sure you need a very large toggle. The smallest stick id consider using would be about 5-6x the diameter of dynaglide where its commonly recommended to use at least 2x. Actually, I'm not sure this would follow the usual larger diameter=better protocol. A larger toggle means the angle where the lead exits the bite is more acute. I'm not sure if this would be better or not. Maybe we should toggle in a way like dutch recommends his tree strap clips where the strap comes off more or less tangent to the side of the tree? Or maybe everyone's been doing this already and I'm just now figuring it out....

I had not thought about the possibility of going to large and causing a different bend issue. Currently I have two arrow shaft toggles, one is about 6mm and the other is about 9mm and was trying to figure out which is going to work better. I agree with the Phantom Grappler that a smooth toggle will be better and at 0.9 grams for the small one I think that would be better in general than looking for sticks at each campsite.

Originally Posted by Theguywitheyebrows

thinking about the smallishness of the dynaglide being a problem has me thinking: pull the dynaglide through a shortish piece of amsteel to use as a cover for the dynaglide where it bends/gets bent over the most? just a thought, tossed out in a stream...might catch and build an island, but not if i don't let it free.

We have tried something similar to that in a few of our past experiments in an attempt to add some coefficient of friction to the rope and it bunched up pretty bad under load. We were not trying it to protect the line from a stick so I don't know how well that would work, but I tend to think based on that experience that a line sleeve would only complicate things unnecessarily.

**Theguywitheyebrows** · 09-29-2015, 13:16

you guys beat me to pretty much everything i think of. sometimes i think im reinventing the wheel, and you guys have shown that it fails. best forum ever.

**mophead** · 09-29-2015, 13:25

9mm probably isnt going to cause any issues. I was kind of thinking you had larger trail sticks in mind. Even with the smaller dia. toggles though I think if you place the toggle on top of the CL while you are cinching bite down it might help. If you look at the tree strap take off position recommended for dutch clips it kind of illustrates what im thinking. So by positioning the toggle on top of the CL when you cinch the bite down the angle which the suspension lines break out of the loop is more or less straight.

Heres a shot with the toggle pulled out (orange is CL green dynaglide is suspension from tree):
IMG_0907.JPG

And if you had a much larger toggle this becomes harder to do, its almost breaking at a 90º angle:
IMG_0906.JPG

This is all just guesswork at this point though, may not be any better... could even be worse.

**SGT Rock** · 09-29-2015, 19:12

I hadn't thought about doing it over the CL. That is something I plan to play with. Thanks for sparking a new idea!

**mophead** · 09-29-2015, 22:27

I originally tried it that way because I was afraid of the CL being squeezed by the suspension line against the toggle. Turns out that does really happen anyway. I am trying some kevlar straps (2.7g per foot) and think I'm going to stick with the 7/64 for now just so I am only changing one thing at a time. Plus, I am kind of liking the ease of just tying a quick hitch and being done. I am still tinkering with the goal of having something like that for dynaglide but not sure if it will work out without some kind of toggle or some new titanium bling.

**SGT Rock** · 09-30-2015, 02:58

I know what you mean. I like the simplicity of a bend with the amsteel and I am not sure the 6.8 gram savings is worth it other than for the experimental value.