Hammock plan from a new guy

[Haganaga]

Hi everyone,

I’m new here (first post!) and looking to get off the ground. I have a plan but wanted to run this by those of you who are much more knowledgeable on the subject of hammock camping.

TL;DR version:

Me
• 6’0”
• 210 lbs

Types of Camping
• Boundary Waters trips
• Hiking trips
• Overnight winter camps
• Maybe a car camp here or there

Boundary Waters & Hiking trip set-up plan
• Hammock: Warbonnet Blackbird XLC 1.1 Double Layer with Whoopie Slings
• Tarp: Warbonnet Superfly which I want to pole mod like I’ve seen here (poles would stay home for hiking trips)
• Bottom Insulation: Thermarest Prolite 4 (eventually I’d get Hammock Gear Incubator 20)
• Top Insulation: Marmot Helium 15 (long) used as a quilt

Winter set-up plan
• Hammock: Same as above
• Tarp: Same as above
• Bottom Insulation: HG Incubator 20 with Thermarest Prolite 4 between the BB layers
• Top Insulation: Bag from above zipped up and coupled with Sea-to-Summit Reactor liner (the one with the orange sack)

Long version:
I’ll mainly be using this set-up for weeklong trips to the Boundary Waters and weeklong hiking trips. I’m turning 40 this year so I want more comfort and less weight than my current tent set-up which is a North Face Tadpole that comes in north of six pounds. For ground support, I use an an Exped Downmat 7 DLX in BWCA and a Thermarest Prolite 4 for hiking. This year, we’re returning to the Boundary Waters in mid-August. The Prolite 4 in my plan above is merely a stop gap until I can spring for a HG Incubator 20. When I told my wife I was thinking of buying a hammock and tarp it was met with, “Really? More camping stuff?” comments so I’m playing the long game here and an underquilt will not be realized until 2016.

I also do one overnight winter camp a year in January in northern Illinois. In the past, I’ve used my Exped mat with my Marmot bag and if it’s going to get below 15, I add a Sea-to-Summit Reactor liner (the one with the yellow sack). On one of the trips, it got down to 8 degrees overnight but I never felt a hint of cold. The underquilt I have in my sights is the Hammock Gear Incubator 20. I’m hoping if I get the Incubator 20 and couple that with the Prolite 4 or Exped and the Helium with liner combo I’ll be OK for winter camping. It seems like that should work but if I’m just looking for trouble, I can always stay to the ground. I’m not sure if the Exped would fit between the layers of the Blackbird but if it does, that should provide even more warmth.

Sorry for the long post and if you’ve read this far, thanks for taking the time. If you guys could give me your thoughts on my plan, I would really appreciate it. I’ve been reading here for a while and just signed up the other day. The wealth of information on this site is amazing so thanks to you all!

[ktitan]

Warbonnet makes great stuff, but I probably would go with a much cheaper gathered end hammock and put the money into the underquilt now. Many people find that a gathered end hammock is very comfortable and they don't have reason to upgrade other than for prestige. Look at http://dutchwaregear.com/ for a much more affordable setup. Or you may want to consider something like a skeeter beeter pro, because it has the bug net built in.

Assuming you are often paddling something, given your destination, looking at a synthetic underquilt makes some sense. So I would look at a 3 season synthetic KAQuilt at arrowhead equipment they are much cheaper than down and still a very good product. In the winter I would add a cheap closed foam cell pad.

[SilvrSurfr]

Warbonnet makes great stuff, but I probably would go with a much cheaper gathered end hammock and put the money into the underquilt now.

I'd agree with that assessment. The UQ will provide a great increase in comfort, whereas a high-end hammock is more about features, without any guarantee that you'll find it more comfortable than a simple, gathered-end hammock (though some folks swear by the footbox). The XLC 1.1 with top cover will run $265, whereas the Incubator 20* is $249.

Of course, when I was a noob I thought the hammock was the most important thing. I've since changed my opinion.

[cbsinnett]

I agree Warbonnet makes great gear.

I started with a $25 gathered end hammock from Wal Mart then got a HH with bug net and just sold it and went back to gathered end from Dutchware.com.
also got the Fronkey stlye bug net to use in the couple of months that I need it and leave it at home when I don't.

As I learned more I liked the idea of being more in control of making fine adjustments to my setup myself.

I did get the warbonnet Super Fly, you just cant beat the price for the coverage you get.

[DanglingModifier]

Let me add another vote for getting a good UQ + inexpensive bare bones 11' hammock now versus a high end hammock.

This is coming from a guy who bought EXACTLY the hammock and tarp you're looking at as my first major hammock related purchases. If I could do it over again I'd still get the SuperFly up front, but I would have bought the UQ before deciding on the exact high-end hammock I wanted. Even with a DL hammock, most of us find using a pad pretty fussy.

Comfort and warmth trump the footbox and shelf, and being cold in your new $250 hammock sucks. That said, the XLC is a great hammock, and the shelf and footbox are wonderful features.

[NM_Leo]

I agree with everyone above...quilts are where you should start spending the big $$. That does assume you know that hammocking is for you. If you haven't tried a hammock, buy one...I do like those dutch hammocks. Get a hammock first and try it out. once you know you are hooked, get a quality UQ. if you will be doing any cold weather camping 30 deg or less, I suggest a full length quilt. I have both 3/4 and a full, because I started with a 3/4...and wanted to camp in sub 30 deg weather. it was just so much more comfortable because I didn't struggle to stay warm. TQ can come later...most folks have sleeping bags when they start. when you do start to wonder, a TQ is so much better. I waited about a year to buy it, but its just amazing to see how much better it packs down and weighs so much less...love those quilts.

[bkrgi]

Spend the money first on the Down 20* UQ and tarp (warm and dry is critical). Now if the budget still allows the WBBB Hammock go for it...otherwise as others have said cheap out there. The Helium works great as a top quilt (What I use) and is easily supplemented for winter.
And since your planing winter camping below the 20* mark save the coin over the summer and add a 0* UQ. Consider the quilts as a long term investment and since life in the Hammy is so darn comfy you might be finding many more reasons to hang yourself...just sayin...be prepared

[Haganaga]

Thanks for all the responses. You guys are awesome and make a very good point. Now I'm in another quandary. If I look at this from a cost standpoint, it would be more to do the Dutch hammock. Walk with me here:

WBBB XLC 1.1 w/ Whoopies = $210
Dutch Argon = $114 because of $30 (hammock) + $39 (whoopie suspension/tree huggers) + $45 (fronkey bugnet)

Sounds like a no brainer at first but in the Dutch, it doesn't look like using my Prolite is an option (or an option I want, anyway) while I could slide it between the layers of the WBBB. That means I have to get an underquilt and the Incubator runs $250. So my minimum starting investment between the two options is $210 (WBBB) vs. $364 (Dutch). But that's not the end of the story. If I get the Dutch w/ suspension, I can test it out at a cost of $69 and see if this is for me. This is a huge benefit. If it isn't for me, I'm only out 70 bucks and I could still sell it. Assuming it is for me, I have no choice but to buy the bugnet (BWCA = must have bug protection) plus I'll need to get the underquilt. Decisions decisions.

I'm now pretty convinced the Dutch is the best choice. Just spend the $70 and hang it up in the garage to give it a whirl. Speaking of Dutch hammocks, can someone give me a brief download of the pros/cons of the Argon vs. the PolyD?

Thanks again for all the responses!

[SilvrSurfr]

Sounds like a no brainer at first but in the Dutch, it doesn't look like using my Prolite is an option (or an option I want, anyway) while I could slide it between the layers of the WBBB.

The more requirements you place on your setup, the more it will weigh and cost, usually. If you want a DL to manage a pad, it costs and weighs more. Wanna use your hammock as a ground bivy? Same same. I have a couple of DL hammocks and they don't come out of the closet anymore because I no longer use pads. The DL was a requirement for me when I bought them, but once I found out that my condensation issues disappeared with underquilts, I haven't used a pad since.

And you will get condensation if you use a pad in a hammock due to convective air currents flowing underneath the hammock (unless you're one of the extremely lucky, and very few, who either don't notice, don't mind, or don't have condensation issues with pads). I always used a synthetic sleeping bag with my pad because I didn't want my down soaking in my condensation.

Also, the R-value of your pads are for ground sleeping; it's not going to be the same in a hammock. So don't be surprised if the Exped or Thermarest can't keep you toasty warm at 8 degrees as it did on the ground. Once you do get an underquilt you'll probably rue the day you made a double layer one of your setup requirements.

Also, one of the advantages of a modular hammock system is that suspension and bugnet are one-time costs. If you start with the Argon and decide it's too stretchy, for $35 you can try the PolyD (less stretch). I absolutely love having the flexibility to try new hammock fabrics so affordably; I probably never would have discovered that I prefer polyester hammocks otherwise. To each his own, HYOH, and all that rigamarole, but I find the real innovation in hammocks right now is fabrics, not features. Then again, you might be a feature guy, who wants to explore the world of zippers, removeable nets/topcovers, hammock tie-outs (all integrated bugnet hammocks seem to have tie-outs), peak bags, ridgeline organizers, footboxes, gear shelves, etc.

[ktitan]

Thanks for all the responses. You guys are awesome and make a very good point. Now I'm in another quandary. If I look at this from a cost standpoint, it would be more to do the Dutch hammock. Walk with me here:
WBBB XLC 1.1 w/ Whoopies = $210
Dutch Argon = $114 because of $30 (hammock) + $39 (whoopie suspension/tree huggers) + $45 (fronkey bugnet)

Part of that is the reason I made the other suggestion of the skeeter beeter pro. Most people I've seen find it fairly comfortable, it has an integrated bugnet (which some people like some people don't) and it comes with ropes to hang (you would have to spend a few more dollars for straps around the trees) I see them often for $69 shipped. Later you could swap out the ropes for lighter suspension. You could also go with dutch and skip the whoopie suspension and use cheaper thicker rope and tie knots when you hang. Then add lighter fancier extras one at a time.