Sleeping bags

[megasupermagnum]

I guess that's where we disagree. I regularly have read on forums, and in articles those who have aggressively pushed for quilts over sleeping bags. At best you hear bags work if it's what you have, implying quilts are the better option. Telling someone to use a sleeping bag they have when they are beginners is not advocating for sleeping bags, although it is good advice. Telling people to try different things is also good advice, at least within reason. I would always try someone else gear first if you can. Dropping $400 on a top quilt just to see how they are is pretty steep if you ask me. I often hear that if you don't like it, you can sell it. Maybe I'm a terrible salesman, but I find it an absolute chore to sell things like that. Sometimes it takes months to get 3/4 of your money back.

One problem I see is often peoples opinions are a little skewed. I've stated a couple of these things in this thread, the main one being weight. There are absolutely sleeping bags every bit as light as the lightest quilts. Here's an article I found with a 2 minute search. https://hammockgear.com/news/why-bac...g-bags-7074e7/

#1 Quilts are lighter- This isn't true. I proved it's not true in the very first example I looked up. You could cherry pick examples, but the truth is there are absolutely bags that are as light as the lightest quilts out there.

#2 quilts are warmer- This is a prime example of someone aggressively pushing their view with no basis. Sure there can be variation in the temp ratings which have no standard. You could make the argument that quilts can be as warm as bags. They absolutely are not warmer than bags, not at all. The idea that what is essentially a blanket, can be warmer than something that surrounds you on all sides and you zip into. Fail.

#3 quilts are more packable- This might be true, I don't know. I'll leave this to someone else to argue over. If it is true, this is something people should talk about and quantify more.

#4 quilts are more affordable- maybe? It does seem the top of the line top quilts depending on rating are $300-$400. A really warm one appears to get close to $500. Comparable top of the line sleeping bags seem to be $400-$500. Sleeping bags can get way more expensive, but thats due to the cold rating, and use, because... shocker, they are much warmer. Western Mountaineering for example has bags over $1000. Unless you are in the arctic circle, you wouldn't even consider those bags. As I posted earlier, For $160, you can buy a sleeping bag that is warmer than any top quilt on the market, it's just bigger and heavier. There's also lower cost top quilts that are decent, that are also bigger and heavier too.

#5 quilts are better ventilated- No, no they are not. I guess they are when you don't want them to be. You can unzip a sleeping bag. You can then get out of the bag and use it as a top quilt. You can throw half the bag off and use it to cover your legs. There's not one thing a top quilt can to as far as coverage that a sleeping bag cant. There's a few things a sleeping bag can do that a top quilt can't though, such as have back insulation, and zip up inside.


So I guess you could say I am aggressively pushing for sleeping bags, which in this thread is true. I'm never going to argue with someone who likes top quilts, they already found what they like. This thread is more for either beginners, or those who aren't completely sold on their setup. It might even be for those in warm areas with top quilts, but want to try winter camping in a colder area. I just wish we could all be more honest on what the differences between them are.

[sloanie]

I can appreciate the challenge to what seems like camping dogma. There are some things I disagree with that are commonly averred by seasoned hammock campers. They probably boil down to variables that are different for me than the average hanger.

I haven’t seen #2-#4 argued / asserted before; but clearly I haven’t spent much time outside this specific forum looking at the subject. I actually haven’t seen much debate between the 2 in general; there are scenarios where a sleeping bag solves certain issues (like keeping your arms warm when using an Amok Draumr where you’re basically sleeping on a pad in the air).

As for #1 — it is a relative truth— a quilt would be lighter than a sleeping bag made with the same materials and fill by virtue of using less material. It’s not an absolute truth, as you pointed out. Before I was aware of hammock camping as a thing, I had bought a sleeping bag where, instead of being insulated all the way around, it had a sleeve on the bottom for a pad. So, even this principle of eliminating insulation that might otherwise be less efficient in order to save some weight / bulk isn’t unique to the quilt.

#5 I’d say is more how easy it is to vent than overall ventability. Also subjective… since there are sleeping bag designs that build in some features for venting that might in some cases be more desirable than just sticking a foot or arm out.

Anyways. I do like using quilts, I also personally find it more awkward / challenging to get in and out of a full sleeping bag in a hammock, but I’m sure with practice it’s fine, and at the very least it may be worth the trade off. Also, because I’m not optimizing for weight, the last quilt I bought was particularly wide and also full-zip so it can function largely as a sleeping bag

Maybe I’ll take a look at what higher end sleeping bags look and function like. Because the one thing I’m coming away from this thread with is a curiosity for how a sleeping bag might be designed / optimized differently for hammock campers. Are any of the bags you’ve been discussing designed with that in mind? Maybe there’s some opportunity for innovation.

[megasupermagnum]

As for #1 — it is a relative truth— a quilt would be lighter than a sleeping bag made with the same materials and fill by virtue of using less material. It’s not an absolute truth, as you pointed out. Before I was aware of hammock camping as a thing, I had bought a sleeping bag where, instead of being insulated all the way around, it had a sleeve on the bottom for a pad. So, even this principle of eliminating insulation that might otherwise be less efficient in order to save some weight / bulk isn’t unique to the quilt..

I think this would be correct, but if you made a quilt with the same materials, same fill, same everything, it would not be anywhere close to as warm as the sleeping bag. Obviously in both ground and hammock you have to take your bottom insulation into account, but your sleeping bag does provide bottom insulation.

If I were to give advice to beginners, I would have to say before you drop a ton of money on a top quilt, take your sleeping bag, and use that as your top quilt. If its warm enough, and you like the freedom of movement, or comfort, or whatever, then by all means, buy a top quilt. If you try it, and you find it cold and annoying, then a $200 top quilt isn't going to help that. I don't know about the really fancy $400+ top quilts with the elastic and draft collars, and special foot boxes and all that to make them 90% of a sleeping bag.

[Pavel]

if your criterea is used - same fill etc, the bag would weigh close to twice as much. I have both quilts and sleeping bags but over the years the sleeping bags are showing their negatives more and more. Getting in and out, whether I'm on the ground in a tent or even more in one of my hammocks is enough to wake me up much more and I have a harder time getting back to sleep. I also often find myself waking up more in one of my bags because it becomes twisted as I move in my sleep. Oddly enough I like my Montbell sleeping bags better in my hammock, but hate using them in my tents except opened up like a top quilt, where only the hood gets in the way.

[mattnin]

I find sleeping bags to be quite comfortable in a hammock. I kind of just zip it up a bit from the bottom and get into it like a quilt with a foot box and if it's really cold just zip it up all the way over my head, snug as a bug and sleeping in late! That being said, I own three top quilts too, but I can definitely see why some people prefer sleeping bags over quilts because they can zip them up and get all snug and cozy, but maybe someone doesn't like that and prefer the more open nature of the top quilts. They both have their place in the hammock world in my opinion.

My last trip, I actually packed both a top quilt and sleeping bag! I did not expect it to be as cold as it was and spent most of the night shivering in the car in a sleeping bag at the trailhead. I thought no way would my quilt keep me warm all by itself if I couldn't even stay warm inside my car in a sleeping bag, so I decided to pack up my wiggy's bag and my top quilt. Talk about a heavy pack but I did not wake up cold again. I stuffed the top quilt into the sleeping bag and ahh it was so nice and warm, actually had to unzip the sleeping bag every night because I was sweating even though it was freezing outside. It was such a nice and starry night, although frosty, I even packed up the tarp so when I stir during the middle of the night, I can peek my head out of the sleeping bag so I could catch a glimpse of the stars.

[HangingOut]

I will add a big +1 on the Feathered Friends Tanager. I got one a few years ago and it has been my go-to bag ever since. It comes in at around 20 oz in a dyneema stuff sack. I always take a lite down puffy and insulated pants and often sleep in both in cooler weather in the high Cascades.

Here is a photo of my setup with a Superior 30* integrated hammock paired with a Warbonnet bugnet sock and my Tanager bag. Nice combo.

Camp at frosty junction.jpg

[sloanie]

I will add a big +1 on the Feathered Friends Tanager. I got one a few years ago and it has been my go-to bag ever since. It comes in at around 20 oz in a dyneema stuff sack. I always take a lite down puffy and insulated pants and often sleep in both in cooler weather in the high Cascades.

Here is a photo of my setup with a Superior 30* integrated hammock paired with a Warbonnet bugnet sock and my Tanager bag. Nice combo.

Camp at frosty junction.jpg

I’m curious— tell me about your use of the warbonnet bug net sock rather than the Superior hammock bug net.

[HangingOut]

I’m curious— tell me about your use of the warbonnet bug net sock rather than the Superior hammock bug net.

Well, there are two main reasons. Number one, I like trying new gear and I got one of the first models of the Superior after it was introduced and it didn't have any add-on options like a bug net at that time. The second reason is that I already had a Warbonnet bug sock sitting on my gear shelf that would fit the Superior so I just used it.

Actually, I think this configuration might be slightly better because the bug sock sort of acts like an under quilt protector and does add some weather protection and warmth. You can also throw small lite things into the bottom of the sock to help de-clutter the hammock. I don't mind this configuration at all.

[sloanie]

Well, there are two main reasons. Number one, I like trying new gear and I got one of the first models of the Superior after it was introduced and it didn't have any add-on options like a bug net at that time. The second reason is that I already had a Warbonnet bug sock sitting on my gear shelf that would fit the Superior so I just used it.

Actually, I think this configuration might be slightly better because the bug sock sort of acts like an under quilt protector and does add some weather protection and warmth. You can also throw small lite things into the bottom of the sock to help de-clutter the hammock. I don't mind this configuration at all.

Ahh that makes sense. I forget that the Superior didn’t initially have that option. I asked because I wondered if there was an advantage to the separate bug net sock. I should try it… the zip-on bug net is convenient and I’ve been using hammocks with them for years (Chameleon, Trail Lair, Superior), but often feel like the bug net is restricting how diagonal I can get in the hammock.

Anyways, apologies for deviating from the sleeping bag topic I did once nearly buy a Feathered Friends bag; I was looking at their rectangle Condor bag though. Maybe I’ll give it another look…. :P